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Re: Orange spirochete indictment thread

2551 by Wino
The republican party is in tatters and of little relevance. MAGA rules and will continue to do so should turd win. Think we're all learning just how hard democracy is to hang onto. I'm hopeful this nation survives and expect it will, but not back to the '50's.
"Being Republican is more than a difference of opinion - it's a character flaw." "COVID can fix STUPID!"
The greatest, most aggrieved mistake EVER made by USA was electing DJT as POTUS - TWICE!!!!!

Re: Orange spirochete indictment thread

2552 by VodoundaVinci
Most of the people I know who will be voting Red in November will be doing so for the same reason Liberals I know will be voting Blue - the alternative, to them, is so far off base as to make the decision easy for them. The Republicans I know, many of them family, despise Trump but we get only two choices as you all know. Most Republicans I know are not fond of Trump in any way but Biden, and now Harris and Walz are simply not any better choice.

VooDoo
Tyrants disarm the people they intend to oppress. Hope is not a Plan.

Dot 'em if ya got 'em!

Re: Orange spirochete indictment thread

2553 by sikacz
VodoundaVinci wrote: Wed Aug 28, 2024 10:46 am Most of the people I know who will be voting Red in November will be doing so for the same reason Liberals I know will be voting Blue - the alternative, to them, is so far off base as to make the decision easy for them. The Republicans I know, many of them family, despise Trump but we get only two choices as you all know. Most Republicans I know are not fond of Trump in any way but Biden, and now Harris and Walz are simply not any better choice.

VooDoo
This is a hard concept for a lot of dems to grasp. I blame it on party propaganda.
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"Resistance is futile. You will be assimilated!" Loquacious of many. Texas Chapter Chief Cat Herder.

Re: Orange spirochete indictment thread

2554 by highdesert
sikacz wrote: Wed Aug 28, 2024 10:54 am
VodoundaVinci wrote: Wed Aug 28, 2024 10:46 am Most of the people I know who will be voting Red in November will be doing so for the same reason Liberals I know will be voting Blue - the alternative, to them, is so far off base as to make the decision easy for them. The Republicans I know, many of them family, despise Trump but we get only two choices as you all know. Most Republicans I know are not fond of Trump in any way but Biden, and now Harris and Walz are simply not any better choice.

VooDoo
This is a hard concept for a lot of dems to grasp. I blame it on party propaganda.
Yes all we're given is an either or choice, there is the flawed candidate in column A or the flawed candidate in column B. As the old saying goes, you can't make a silk purse out of a sows ear, they are what they are. People vote against a candidate as much as they vote for someone and many people are programmed to vote for one party, it's the way they've always voted. When a candidate or voters are perceived to be treated unfairly, then the opposing side could pay a price.
"Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but not their own facts." - Daniel Patrick Moynihan

Re: Orange spirochete indictment thread

2555 by YankeeTarheel
highdesert wrote: Wed Aug 28, 2024 11:09 am
sikacz wrote: Wed Aug 28, 2024 10:54 am
VodoundaVinci wrote: Wed Aug 28, 2024 10:46 am Most of the people I know who will be voting Red in November will be doing so for the same reason Liberals I know will be voting Blue - the alternative, to them, is so far off base as to make the decision easy for them. The Republicans I know, many of them family, despise Trump but we get only two choices as you all know. Most Republicans I know are not fond of Trump in any way but Biden, and now Harris and Walz are simply not any better choice.

VooDoo
This is a hard concept for a lot of dems to grasp. I blame it on party propaganda.
Yes all we're given is an either or choice, there is the flawed candidate in column A or the flawed candidate in column B. As the old saying goes, you can't make a silk purse out of a sows ear, they are what they are. People vote against a candidate as much as they vote for someone and many people are programmed to vote for one party, it's the way they've always voted. When a candidate or voters are perceived to be treated unfairly, then the opposing side could pay a price.
I HAVE voted for Republicans in the past, but not often. And I have voted 3rd Party a few times (and thus wasted my vote). I had serious trouble voting for Chuck Robb to be elected Senator and just couldn't. In the 1988 open primary in Va, I wanted to stop GHW Bush so I voted for Dole. And in NJ I voted for Christie Whitman 2x for governor. Considering her opponents, I don't regret it (Florio and McSleezy). I, totally, foolishly, voted for Rodney Frelinghuysen thinking he'd be like Dean Gallo was a strong, Liberal Republican who unfortunately died. BIGGGG mistake! Rubber-stamp Rodney did what GOP leaders wanted, never put his name on ANY legislation, and I worked hard to help defeat him in 2018--he withdrew and we have Mikie Sherrill, who flipped the seat. Now she's running for the 4th time against one of the Jan 6 Capitol attackers.

But now? The only Republicans I would even consider thinking about have all been drummed out of the MAGAt party.

So the "either / or" choice we face in 68(?) days is a meal we may not like, or a dish filled with broken glass and laced with cyanide. Or to starve in protest.
"Even if the bee could explain to the fly why pollen is better than shit, the fly could never understand."

Re: Orange spirochete indictment thread

2557 by Bisbee
So the "either / or" choice we face in 68(?) days is a meal we may not like, or a dish filled with broken glass and laced with cyanide. Or to starve in protest.
I feel this is a very accurate assessment of our presidential election. You see, an election doesn’t happen once every four years. The available candidates are out working 1.5 years before the election and either receiving your work/support —or not. If you haven’t worked on any campaigns, have not financially supported them, then the reality of who you get to choose for in November is out of your hands, no emotions involved. It’s perfectly fine to make the world a better place with your own sweat & hands, and ignore politics altogether (though the tides of politics inevitably affect you nonetheless). But if one does not participate in politics years in advance of an election to later complain about both candidates and refuse to vote, that appears somewhat like whining about one’s own growing irrelevancy due to unconscious disengagement from the issues threatening society.
Active participation of any kind alleviates bitterness or hopelessness. The human spirit is hardwired for cooperative action.
"It is better to be violent, if there is violence in our hearts, than to put on the cloak of non-violence to cover impotence. There is hope for a violent man to become non-violent. There is no such hope for the impotent." -Gandhi

Re: Orange spirochete indictment thread

2558 by Bisbee
It’s worth considering just how Nazi Germany could have been averted by the German citizens before Hitler was elected to office. The entire modern education system of Germany is tinted by this idea because of the human horrors and devastation that Nazi fascism and Hitler brought into the world. We are currently facing something similar with our own megalomaniac coward promising the same: vote for him, allow him into office again, and all future elections would be unnecessary.
"It is better to be violent, if there is violence in our hearts, than to put on the cloak of non-violence to cover impotence. There is hope for a violent man to become non-violent. There is no such hope for the impotent." -Gandhi

Re: Orange spirochete indictment thread

2559 by VodoundaVinci
I'll starve then. I cannot support these candidates who I perceive to be taking money under the table and furthering an agenda that has nothing to benefit the constituency and all the while laughing behind their hands at how they have gamed The System while they grow rich and powerful. I'll take what I get as I have tried to participate locally. I'm not built that way so I'll have to accept what others put on my plate as the best I'm gonna get....but I cannot condone it with my vote, which is a sacred thing if only to me. No votes for Authoritarians or Oligarchy controlled and operated Autocrats. Not from me. You guys choose as best you can....give Peace, Hope and Compliance a chance and when it dun;t work out I'll cover you.

VooDoo
Tyrants disarm the people they intend to oppress. Hope is not a Plan.

Dot 'em if ya got 'em!

Re: Orange spirochete indictment thread

2560 by sikacz
VodoundaVinci wrote: Wed Aug 28, 2024 1:10 pm I'll starve then. I cannot support these candidates who I perceive to be taking money under the table and furthering an agenda that has nothing to benefit the constituency and all the while laughing behind their hands at how they have gamed The System while they grow rich and powerful. I'll take what I get as I have tried to participate locally. I'm not built that way so I'll have to accept what others put on my plate as the best I'm gonna get....but I cannot condone it with my vote, which is a sacred thing if only to me. No votes for Authoritarians or Oligarchy controlled and operated Autocrats. Not from me. You guys choose as best you can....give Peace, Hope and Compliance a chance and when it dun;t work out I'll cover you.

VooDoo
Pretty much the same though. Not going to condone a lighter flavor of authoritarianism.
Btw, dems are not for peace, they egged Ukrainian to fight Russia and likely support Israel’s war on the Palestinians. It’s pure BS to imply the dems represent a peaceful future.
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Image

"Resistance is futile. You will be assimilated!" Loquacious of many. Texas Chapter Chief Cat Herder.

Re: Orange spirochete indictment thread

2561 by YankeeTarheel
VodoundaVinci wrote: Wed Aug 28, 2024 1:10 pm I'll starve then. I cannot support these candidates who I perceive to be taking money under the table and furthering an agenda that has nothing to benefit the constituency and all the while laughing behind their hands at how they have gamed The System while they grow rich and powerful. I'll take what I get as I have tried to participate locally. I'm not built that way so I'll have to accept what others put on my plate as the best I'm gonna get....but I cannot condone it with my vote, which is a sacred thing if only to me. No votes for Authoritarians or Oligarchy controlled and operated Autocrats. Not from me. You guys choose as best you can....give Peace, Hope and Compliance a chance and when it dun;t work out I'll cover you.

VooDoo
How's that working out for you so far?
I tried it multiple times, from the late 1970s to the mid 1990s, living in 4 different states. To paraphrase and mangle an old ditty:
" I was right, dead right, as I sped along. But I was just as dead as if I'd been dead wrong."
"Even if the bee could explain to the fly why pollen is better than shit, the fly could never understand."

Re: Orange spirochete indictment thread

2562 by Ylatkit
Bisbee wrote: Wed Aug 28, 2024 12:56 pm
So the "either / or" choice we face in 68(?) days is a meal we may not like, or a dish filled with broken glass and laced with cyanide. Or to starve in protest.
I feel this is a very accurate assessment of our presidential election.
As do I.
"When I have your wounded." -- Major Charles L. Kelly, callsign "Dustoff", refusing to acknowledge that an L.Z. was too hot, moments before being killed by a single shot, July 1st, 1964.

"Touch it, dude!"

Re: Orange spirochete indictment thread

2564 by TrueTexan
Trump Asks Federal Court To Intervene In Hush Money Case In Bid To Toss Conviction

NEW YORK (AP) — Former President Donald Trump asked a federal court late Thursday to intervene in his New York hush money criminal case, seeking a pathway to overturn his felony conviction and indefinitely delay his sentencing next month.

Lawyers for the current Republican nominee asked the federal court in Manhattan to seize the case from the state court where it was tried, arguing that the historic prosecution violated his constitutional rights and ran afoul of the U.S. Supreme Court’s recent presidential immunity ruling.

Trump’s lawyers, who failed last year in a pretrial bid to get the case shifted to federal court, said moving it now will give him an “unbiased forum, free from local hostilities” to address those issues. In state court, they said, Trump has been the victim of “bias, conflicts of interest, and appearances of impropriety.”

If the case is moved to federal court, Trump’s lawyers said they will then seek to have the verdict overturned and the case dismissed on immunity grounds.

If the case remains in state court and Trump’s sentencing proceeds as scheduled on Sept. 18 — about seven weeks before Election Day — it would be election interference, his lawyers said, raising the specter that Trump could be sent to jail just as early voting is getting under way.

Trump’s request Thursday is poised to be decided by the same Manhattan federal judge who rejected his earlier bid to move the case — a decision that cleared the way for his trial in state court.

“The ongoing proceedings will continue to cause direct and irreparable harm to President Trump — the leading candidate in the 2024 Presidential election — and voters located far beyond Manhattan,” Trump lawyers Todd Blanche and Emil Bove wrote in a 64-page U.S. District Court court filing.

The Manhattan district attorney’s office, which prosecuted Trump’s case and fought his previous effort to move the case out of state court, declined to comment. A message seeking comment was left with a spokesperson for New York’s state court system.
Full long article: https://www.huffpost.com/entry/trump-as ... d61a38a520

TOS fits this quote "Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results."
Facts do not cease to exist because they are ignored.-Huxley
"We can have democracy in this country, or we can have great wealth concentrated in the hands of a few, but we can't have both." ~ Louis Brandeis,

Re: Orange spirochete indictment thread

2565 by highdesert
I'll just drop this link here, it's Elie Honig's article in New York Magazine on Trump's New York conviction. Honig is the legal analyst for CNN and a former state and federal prosecutor. I posted the article before.
Prosecutors Got Trump - But they Contorted the Law
https://nymag.com/intelligencer/article ... e-law.html
"Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but not their own facts." - Daniel Patrick Moynihan

Re: Orange spirochete indictment thread

2566 by Bisbee
highdesert wrote: Thu Aug 29, 2024 8:10 am Trump is fund raising off Jack Smith's revised indictment, Trump plays his victim card like many others do. And I assume that Harris is fund raising off of Vance's "cat lady" comment. It's politics and politicians exploit everything to raise money.
One is using an actual criminal prosecution to portray his personal desire to remain free as an issue which affects all voters. The other is highlighting an actual issue affecting all voters were a competing candidate that panders to right wing zealots actually to gain power. Seems a good example of false equivalency, IMHO. False equivalency leads to cynicism and rejection of the political process, rejection of democracy as a hopelessly ineffective form of government because, “They are all crooks and liars.” But the current alternative to our democracy is to hand back the powers of governing society to a handful of powerful individuals like kings or despots. In this age that would be the Corporatists leading us to an inhuman dystopia akin to “Blade Runner”.
"It is better to be violent, if there is violence in our hearts, than to put on the cloak of non-violence to cover impotence. There is hope for a violent man to become non-violent. There is no such hope for the impotent." -Gandhi

Re: Orange spirochete indictment thread

2567 by highdesert
Our judicial system isn't fair and objective in every case, there are political elements involved in many prosecutions including the Trump and Hunter Biden prosecutions. I'm no Trump fan, but the petition is an attempt to find a more objective venue than the New York state courts. It's not a slam dunk that the US District Court, SDNY will even agree to review the New York state case. Trump's lawyers have to present a compelling reason for the federal courts to take the case.
"Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but not their own facts." - Daniel Patrick Moynihan

Re: Orange spirochete indictment thread

2568 by Ylatkit
TrueTexan wrote: Fri Aug 30, 2024 8:50 am TOS fits this quote "Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results."
An off-topic nit: this definition leaves out persistence.

If I set out to break some concrete, and I hit a piece of concrete with a sledge hammer and nothing happens, I'll hit it again.

But then, I've never needed any alternative explanations of what "insanity" is. I've always been happy with the word defined the way it always has been, is now, and will probably remain so.
"When I have your wounded." -- Major Charles L. Kelly, callsign "Dustoff", refusing to acknowledge that an L.Z. was too hot, moments before being killed by a single shot, July 1st, 1964.

"Touch it, dude!"

Re: Orange spirochete indictment thread

2569 by highdesert
One news source says Trump's request to move the hush money trial to federal court was rejected because the filing was "deficient". His lawyers will probably try to refile. We know courts are partisan and the Southern District of New York has issued partisan decisions.
"Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but not their own facts." - Daniel Patrick Moynihan

Re: Orange spirochete indictment thread

2570 by TrueTexan
highdesert wrote: Sat Aug 31, 2024 9:45 am One news source says Trump's request to move the hush money trial to federal court was rejected because the filing was "deficient". His lawyers will probably try to refile. We know courts are partisan and the Southern District of New York has issued partisan decisions.
"Deficient" just like TOS. Let them refile and let the courts throw that one out too.
Facts do not cease to exist because they are ignored.-Huxley
"We can have democracy in this country, or we can have great wealth concentrated in the hands of a few, but we can't have both." ~ Louis Brandeis,

Re: Orange spirochete indictment thread

2572 by YankeeTarheel
Deficient because the Federal Judge said either the NY prosecutor or Judge Marchan must sign off on Trump's appeal to move the case. Like that's going to happen. Now Gym Jordan and his fellow Trump-nazi, Comer, are trying to intimidate Marchan by a wild-goose chase subpoena to his daughter.
"Even if the bee could explain to the fly why pollen is better than shit, the fly could never understand."

Re: Orange spirochete indictment thread

2574 by CDFingers
The superseding indictment against former President Donald Trump in the Jan. 6 case plots significantly altered terrain for the government — at least in terms of facts and presentation.

--snrp--

The heart of the new version is attuned to the idea that what Trump allegedly did in the aftermath of the November 2020 election — culminating on Jan. 6, 2021 — was done as a private citizen. Linguistic choices by the special counsel’s office showcase this approach.

--snrp--

For example, rather than referring to Trump as the “forty fifth President,” the new indictment introduces the defendant using the still-accurate phrase “a candidate for President.”

--snrp--

As such, whereas the old version alleges Trump “repeated and widely disseminated” false electoral claims, the new version alleges Trump “used his Campaign to repeat and widely disseminate them.”
https://lawandcrime.com/high-profile/al ... -the-case/

For a retired teacher, it's always fun to read the words of a cunning linguist. At the link, there are pictures of the document filed by Smith as well as many other paragraphs that I did not post because more than four.

Buy stock in ketchup and Depends.

CDF
Crazy cat peekin' through a lace bandana
like a one-eyed Cheshire, like a diamond-eye Jack
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