San Francisco police seek permission for its robots to use deadly force

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The San Francisco Police Department is currently petitioning the city's Board of Supervisors for permission to deploy robots to kill suspects that law enforcement deems a sufficient threat that the "risk of loss of life to members of the public or officers is imminent and outweighs any other force option available to SFPD." The draft policy, which was written by the SFPD itself, also seeks to exclude "hundreds of assault rifles from its inventory of military-style weapons and for not include personnel costs in the price of its weapons," according to a report from Mission Local.

As Mission Local notes, this proposal has already seen significant opposition from both within and without the Board. Supervisor Aaron Peskin, initially pushed back against the use of force requirements, inserting “Robots shall not be used as a Use of Force against any person," into the policy language. The SFPD removed that wording in a subsequent draft, which I as a lifelong San Francisco resident did not know was something that they could just do. The three-member Rules Committee, which Peskin chairs, then unanimously approved that draft and advanced it to the full Board of Supervisors for a vote on November 29th. Peskin excused his decision by claiming that “there could be scenarios where deployment of lethal force was the only option.”
Full story:https://www.engadget.com/san-francisco- ... 14906.html

What's next killer drones?
Facts do not cease to exist because they are ignored.-Huxley
"We can have democracy in this country, or we can have great wealth concentrated in the hands of a few, but we can't have both." ~ Louis Brandeis,

Re: San Francisco police seek permission for its robots to use deadly force

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I still remember the huge debate that happened on this forum when a bomb-disposal robot was used to carry explosives toward a sniper that was targeting police officers in Dallas, Texas. They successfully killed him with that robotic bomb.

That was 2016.

Now technological advances have provided drones that can move many times faster than tracked bomb-disposal robot and can carry explosives to drop on top of targets. Never forget that police bombed black activists (MOVE) in Philadelphia, burning down an entire neighborhood. The Police dropped bombs from a helecopter in 1985!

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=X03ErYGB4Kk

Don’t imagine that permission to used weapons delivered by robots or drones will not lead to less violence. Quite the opposite. When police feel safe to employ violence, or kill, with impunity things will get worse in society, not better.
"It is better to be violent, if there is violence in our hearts, than to put on the cloak of non-violence to cover impotence. There is hope for a violent man to become non-violent. There is no such hope for the impotent." -Gandhi

Re: San Francisco police seek permission for its robots to use deadly force

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SFPD does do peaceful resolutions in stand off situations as do all police depts. I'm all for saving LEO's lives in situations where there could be booby traps with explosives in stand off situations.
They don't just willy nilly send in robots to blow people up. Jesus.
Crisis Intervention Team (CIT)
Improving our response to crises involving the mentally ill
Public safety incidents involving the mentally ill have been increasing in recent years, posing a serious challenge for the police and our community. From January 1, 2019 through December 31, 2019, SFPD received 21,860 calls for help in cases involving a person in a behavioral or mental health crisis. These types of incidents include attempted suicides, suspects brandishing weapons, a mentally disturbed person, and youth who are out of their parent’s control. During the same period, SFPD received an additional 28,980 calls to check on the well-being of individuals in distress. Examples of this include someone found lying in the street, running in and out of traffic or believed to be isolated in an apartment.
https://www.sanfranciscopolice.org/your ... n-team-cit
San Francisco's New Street Crisis Response Team Launches Today
Monday, November 30, 2020
Partnership between the Department of Public Health and Fire Department begins with first SCRT Team on the street today with more teams to come as pilot ramps up. SCRT offers a non-police response to calls related to people suffering from mental health and substance use issues on City streets.
San Francisco, CA — Mayor London N. Breed today announced the launch of the first phase of San Francisco’s Street Crisis Response Team (SCRT) pilot program. The first team will begin responding to 911 calls regarding people experiencing behavioral health crises today. The Street Crisis Response Team is part of San Francisco’s efforts to develop alternatives to police responses to non-violent calls, which advances the Mayor’s roadmap to fundamentally change the way that the City handles public safety, and is also a major step in implementing Mental Health SF.

The SCRT pilot program is a collaboration between the San Francisco Department of Public Health and the San Francisco Fire Department with significant support from the Department of Emergency Management. The San Francisco Police Department will also be a key partner in the transition of certain types of 911 calls to the new teams. Each team includes a community paramedic, a behavioral health clinician, and a behavioral health peer specialist. The goal of the new program is to provide an appropriate non-law enforcement response to behavioral health emergencies in San Francisco and divert individuals in crisis away from emergency rooms and criminal legal settings into behavioral health treatment. The SCRT aims to provide trauma-informed clinical interventions and care coordination for people who experience behavioral health crises on the streets of San Francisco.

“This new program can help us break the cycle that all too often keeps people going in and out of our emergency rooms or our jails. When the Street Crisis Response Team responds to a call for someone in crisis, they’ll be able to help with compassion and clinical skills to get people the care and support they need,” said Mayor Breed. “Changing the way we respond to non-violent calls is going to take work and it’s going to take time. The SCRT is an important first step in our long-term effort to change how we respond to people suffering on our streets.”
https://sfmayor.org/article/san-francis ... ches-today
Happiness is a worn gun. - Dan Baum

Re: San Francisco police seek permission for its robots to use deadly force

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Dallas PD used a bomb-toting disposal robot to assassinate a suspect back in 2016. In their defense, it was a sniper attack on LEOs.
https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way ... ot-to-kill

I am philosophically opposed to the use of lethal force by a robot for law enforcement - the whole notion that human life is at risk requires that an actual human life be at risk bringing the suspect in. It's a very short road to Ed 209.

Re: San Francisco police seek permission for its robots to use deadly force

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tonguengroover wrote: Fri Nov 25, 2022 7:00 pm From what I understand - which isn't a lot depending on the time of day - a human must hit a button to initiate the kill with a robot. Robots don't pull the trigger on their own.
This isn't a science fiction movie.
But give someone a chance and they will apply AI to make the choice..
Facts do not cease to exist because they are ignored.-Huxley
"We can have democracy in this country, or we can have great wealth concentrated in the hands of a few, but we can't have both." ~ Louis Brandeis,

Re: San Francisco police seek permission for its robots to use deadly force

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Yeah, "what could go wrong?"

Now, a guy like me will want the bot to have a sticky mesh net it could deploy to snag the bad guy and drag his sorry ass into a containment booth, or to carry tranq darts or what not. Not so sure that would happen. This new lethal bot is an unfortunate but entirely predictable evolution in law enforcement, citizens. hehe

CDFingers
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Re: San Francisco police seek permission for its robots to use deadly force

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How’s about a bot that lays a thick cloud of THC around the perp and provide jelly doughnuts on a plexiglass-covered tray. Just make everything all nice and… hey man, like peace.
"It is better to be violent, if there is violence in our hearts, than to put on the cloak of non-violence to cover impotence. There is hope for a violent man to become non-violent. There is no such hope for the impotent." -Gandhi

Re: San Francisco police seek permission for its robots to use deadly force

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wings wrote:Dallas PD used a bomb-toting disposal robot to assassinate a suspect back in 2016. In their defense, it was a sniper attack on LEOs.
https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way ... ot-to-kill

I am philosophically opposed to the use of lethal force by a robot for law enforcement - the whole notion that human life is at risk requires that an actual human life be at risk bringing the suspect in. It's a very short road to Ed 209.
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This type of thing never ends well …


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Re: San Francisco police seek permission for its robots to use deadly force

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I'm all for it. I hope they have to use it to extract turd from Mar-A-Lardo after his indictments.

In all seriousness - yes, there is always a chance it could/will be misused, but I believe it is a viable option in extenuating circumstances - Dallas was one of those. No different than robots being used to disarm or detonate IED's.
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Re: San Francisco police seek permission for its robots to use deadly force

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These robots aren’t autonomous with AI. They are a ground drone under control of a remote operator. I wonder what will be next Air Drones with Hellfire missiles? I’m sure we have a military surplus of them not being sent to the Ukraine.
Last edited by TrueTexan on Wed Nov 30, 2022 2:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Facts do not cease to exist because they are ignored.-Huxley
"We can have democracy in this country, or we can have great wealth concentrated in the hands of a few, but we can't have both." ~ Louis Brandeis,

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