http://www.mcall.com/news/breaking/mc-n ... 7551.story

"According to emergency radio dispatches, which have not been confirmed by police, the man accidentally shot himself in the abdomen while removing a muzzle-loader from his vehicle."

Very sad, and particularly jarring because I was planning to be there today.

Quite tragic. I gotta ask: Why would anyone have a loaded muzzle loader in a vehicle? Did he load it somewhere he could not discharge it safely/legally? Damn.

Hey the hours at that place are better for me than efga, and cheaper too, plus there's trap.

JayFromPA wrote:Hey the hours at that place are better for me than efga, and cheaper too, plus there's trap.

Yeah, it's a good range. I hope this sad event doesn't shut them down.

The hours listed on the website are for the clubhouse. Shooting hours are approximately dawn (maybe later on weekends) til dusk every day. The range has a couple of unsual rules: no human silhouette targets, only 3 rounds loaded at a time, no FMJ rifle ammo. Weird, but at $25/year for unlimited shooting, I'm not complaining.

MtnMan wrote:

JayFromPA wrote:Hey the hours at that place are better for me than efga, and cheaper too, plus there's trap.

Yeah, it's a good range. I hope this sad event doesn't shut them down.

The hours listed on the website are for the clubhouse. Shooting hours are approximately dawn (maybe later on weekends) til dusk every day. The range has a couple of unsual rules: no human silhouette targets, only 3 rounds loaded at a time, no FMJ rifle ammo. Weird, but at $25/year for unlimited shooting, I'm not complaining.

Jeez, those are worse rules than SGL.

Ontelaunee is a lot better. The only one they have is, no full auto. $25/yr for a new membership. $20/yr for renewal.

They've got a ton of trap shooting (I don't own a shotgun, so I'm not really all to familiar with that aspect of the range).

They also have a 25 yard pistol range, 50 yard, 100 yard, 200 yard, and 300 yard rifle ranges. They have additional pistol ranges as well but those are for pistol team practice only; there are no target stands or anything for those.

They also have stuff for archery, but again, that's not really my bag so I'm not familiar with what they have.

MtnMan wrote:

JayFromPA wrote:Hey the hours at that place are better for me than efga, and cheaper too, plus there's trap.

Yeah, it's a good range. I hope this sad event doesn't shut them down.

The hours listed on the website are for the clubhouse. Shooting hours are approximately dawn (maybe later on weekends) til dusk every day. The range has a couple of unsual rules: no human silhouette targets, only 3 rounds loaded at a time, no FMJ rifle ammo. Weird, but at $25/year for unlimited shooting, I'm not complaining.

I like the sound of those rules. Keep the tactifool wannabees off the range and let the serious shooters work on their skills.

masonalannz wrote:I like the sound of those rules. Keep the tactifool wannabees off the range and let the serious shooters work on their skills.

Yup, that is exactly the intention. I've often had the place to myself, and it's neat to hear the tweetybirds between shots. Going to the gun range for some peace and quiet... strange, but cool.

Of course, I also enjoy the local smoky, dim, grungy, cheap indoor range, where the only rule seems to be, "no more shotguns, after that dumbass who blew out half the lights."

goosekiller wrote:Quite tragic. I gotta ask: Why would anyone have a loaded muzzle loader in a vehicle? Did he load it somewhere he could not discharge it safely/legally? Damn.

My thoughts exactly. RIP

Man, that is horrible.

And you guys have cheap membership to ranges. The ranges here that are member ranges run in the area of $150-$400 per year. Of course, these are private ranges and not open to non-members except as guests. You also usually have access as you please via some sort of gate key or something.

mark wrote:Man, that is horrible.

And you guys have cheap membership to ranges. The ranges here that are member ranges run in the area of $150-$400 per year. Of course, these are private ranges and not open to non-members except as guests. You also usually have access as you please via some sort of gate key or something.

Onelaunee doesn't even allow guests. They used to, but they had vandalism. So they cancelled that policy.

masonalannz wrote:

MtnMan wrote:

JayFromPA wrote:Hey the hours at that place are better for me than efga, and cheaper too, plus there's trap.

Yeah, it's a good range. I hope this sad event doesn't shut them down.

The hours listed on the website are for the clubhouse. Shooting hours are approximately dawn (maybe later on weekends) til dusk every day. The range has a couple of unsual rules: no human silhouette targets, only 3 rounds loaded at a time, no FMJ rifle ammo. Weird, but at $25/year for unlimited shooting, I'm not complaining.

I like the sound of those rules. Keep the tactifool wannabees off the range and let the serious shooters work on their skills.

So now USPSA and CMP Service Rifle matches are "tacticool"? Also, unless it is a backstop problem or something, no FMJ is a bit silly as well, and not very "tacticool".

Strmtrper6 wrote:So now USPSA and CMP Service Rifle matches are "tacticool"? Also, unless it is a backstop problem or something, no FMJ is a bit silly as well, and not very "tacticool".

The only outdoors with a decent rifle range in my area also has a no FMJ policy. It sucks (I have a couple of Russian SKSs). But I understand as they are suffering from urban encroachment, and have been very close to being shut down, which would be a shame.

We are also limited to a few second timeouts between shots to avoid "rapid fire" drills.

Welcome aboard strmtrooper6.

Xela

masonalannz wrote:

MtnMan wrote:

JayFromPA wrote:Hey the hours at that place are better for me than efga, and cheaper too, plus there's trap.

Yeah, it's a good range. I hope this sad event doesn't shut them down.

The hours listed on the website are for the clubhouse. Shooting hours are approximately dawn (maybe later on weekends) til dusk every day. The range has a couple of unsual rules: no human silhouette targets, only 3 rounds loaded at a time, no FMJ rifle ammo. Weird, but at $25/year for unlimited shooting, I'm not complaining.

I like the sound of those rules. Keep the tactifool wannabees off the range and let the serious shooters work on their skills.

That sounds like a great range, and I am glad it's there. Hopefully some of the folks at the ranges I go to will migrate there. Ya' know, the guys who sit and hog a lane or two for a few hours at a time just so they can print two tiny groups on distant paper with circles drawn on it, and then go home.

There are many shooters out there, and just like everything else in life, they enjoy shooting in different ways and for different reasons. Some of us enjoy shooting itself as much or more than sitting in one place and calculating for long periods how to achieve the exact same trajectory through the exact same space for a few rounds. This doesn't make one group better than the other, or anyones experience less valid. Sorry, it doesn't. And attempting to demonize someone just because their idea of fun is different from yours is silly. Slow fire from a bench is just another aspect of the shooting sports, and although just as valid as defensive shooting, or even just having some fun firing rounds, it is in fact no more noble than anything else.

I kinda see your point, Amir, but it has been my experience at the uncontrolled range I use that untrained, no muzzle discipline, no range etiquette, can't hit paper at 25 yds (If they even bought any with them) idiots tend to gravitate to the "Tactical" stuff and hi cap mags, particularly bubba'd SKS's, black Mossbergs and AK variants.

It was so bad the first time we took my hunting buddies wife to the range that she won't go back.

masonalannz wrote: it has been my experience at the uncontrolled range I use that untrained, no muzzle discipline, no range etiquette, can't hit paper at 25 yds

So the issue is irresponsible, dangerous, untrained assholes rather than those who don't slow-fire from the bench. Believe me, there are those in every discipline, I have been on a public unmonitored cold range, down range replacing targets, only to look back and see a "sniper wanna be" hunkered down and sighting in on a target near to me. Assholes are all around man. Check out a range where IDPA or similar are gathering, and I bet the issues you mentioned are not a problem there, even though there will probably be some "tacticool" types around.

AmirMortal wrote:

masonalannz wrote: it has been my experience at the uncontrolled range I use that untrained, no muzzle discipline, no range etiquette, can't hit paper at 25 yds

So the issue is irresponsible, dangerous, untrained assholes rather than those who don't slow-fire from the bench. Believe me, there are those in every discipline, I have been on a public unmonitored cold range, down range replacing targets, only to look back and see a "sniper wanna be" hunkered down and sighting in on a target near to me. Assholes are all around man. Check out a range where IDPA or similar are gathering, and I bet the issues you mentioned are not a problem there, even though there will probably be some "tacticool" types around.

I'm just saying I can totally see why a range would seek to shut that shit out completely and thats the kinda place I wish I had availiable to shoot.

Plus.. I think it's really funny and totally lame the amount of people who are trying/pretending to be an "operator" cause they've watched too much TV and played too many video games. It to me is a symptom of our fucked up, entertainment media controlled, no actual substance society. I don't think there are too many actual war vets who wanna do that crap cause in real life it sucks. I know I could word my point better if I sat down and went at it like a term paper but life is short. Sorry man, I think shooting at human sils is fucked and borderline sociopathic. I see all the IDPA and tacticool stuff as fantasizing about killing people which I think is uncool. Not saying that I don't think there are too many people in the world but I don't personally want to eradicate them. Get my drift?

masonalannz wrote:Sorry man, I think shooting at human sils is fucked and borderline sociopathic. I see all the IDPA and tacticool stuff as fantasizing about killing people which I think is uncool. Not saying that I don't think there are too many people in the world but I don't personally want to eradicate them. Get my drift?

I dunno, I see sense in the idea of practicing with paper that represents the expected problem. If your first reason for owning and using is for reaching out and poking a hole where you want it to be, enjoying a zen-like mastery of self, then the target for you is the round bullseye. If your first reason for owning and using is to be accurate after you've been sitting still in a tree for hours waiting for a deer to approach your firing lane, then you use a deer silhouette. If your first reason for owning and maybe carrying is to fend off a fellow two-legger that is not honoring the social compact against non-violence against two-leggers, than you use a human silhouette target.

A diary on kos a few weeks ago described a guy's relocation to way way rural maine, an area where people waved to each other on the road just because they were there on the road. An area like that, highly unlikely there's violent person-on-person attacks, so there's no expectation of a need for defense against a human and it reasonably follows there isn't a market for human silhouette targets. But deer shaped targets would be perfectly fine. Now shift to the city. Except for the very few people who have enough scratch to regularly hit the woods for hunting, you aren't going to find a market for deer targets. But person-on-person violence will elevate the need for person-shaped targets.

So, human silhouette paper sociopathic? Absolutely not, in my opinion. Not in a blanket manner, at least. Consideration for regional norms and personal history of the individual has to be taken into account before a final judgment can be expected to stick.

Update on this story. Aparently the guy comitted suicide.

With a get shot from a muzzle loader? Why didn't he just stab or bludgeon himself to death?

goosekiller wrote:With a get shot from a muzzle loader? Why didn't he just stab or bludgeon himself to death?

No details on how the police came to the conclusion. I'm guessing he intended to kill himself with the gun, but screwed up.

A gut shot is NOT the way to go.

A whole week for that to come out, he didn't leave the suicide note in his car, which would have been gone through that day and taken to some garage yard for temp storage.

Going to start clearing out a family member's home after an accidental shooting death and finding a suicide note is not the most awesome way to learn that information.