Democratic Pennsylvania governor calls for closing gun show "loophole," etc.

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Gov. Wolf calls recent mass shootings ‘appalling,' reiterates call for gun reforms
Wolf, a Democrat, called for Pennsylvania legislators to remove the background check loophole that allows shotguns, sporting rifles and semiautomatic rifles to be sold at gun shows without a background check.

He also called for legislation to require Pennsylvania gun owners to report lost or stolen guns. The Trace, an investigative journalism site focused on guns, reported that the vast majority of the 23,000 stolen firearms recovered by police between 2010 and 2016 were connected with crimes.

In Pittsburgh last year, police officials reported that half of the guns seized in cases involving kids and firearms were stolen.

Re: Democratic Pennsylvania governor calls for closing gun show "loophole," etc.

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sikacz wrote: Wed May 18, 2022 9:52 pm That’s a bunch of BS. There’s not one FFL that I know that sells guns without a background check at gun shows. This is simply a dog whistle to go after private sales regardless of where they take place.
Pretty sure thats what they are talking about ie gun show loophole. Private sellers at guns shows, not FFL's. We have both at guns shows here.
Pence makes no sense

Re: Democratic Pennsylvania governor calls for closing gun show "loophole," etc.

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tonguengroover wrote: Wed May 18, 2022 10:21 pm
sikacz wrote: Wed May 18, 2022 9:52 pm That’s a bunch of BS. There’s not one FFL that I know that sells guns without a background check at gun shows. This is simply a dog whistle to go after private sales regardless of where they take place.
Pretty sure thats what they are talking about ie gun show loophole. Private sellers at guns shows, not FFL's. We have both at guns shows here.
That isn’t a loophole. Private sales were intentionally left out, and I can’t see overturning that idea just to catch a few private sellers in or out of a gunshow. If my niece wants to buy one of my guns I should be able to sell it to her without an FFL.
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"Resistance is futile. You will be assimilated!" Loquacious of many. Texas Chapter Chief Cat Herder.

Re: Democratic Pennsylvania governor calls for closing gun show "loophole," etc.

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Wolf is term limited. Republicans nominated a bible thumping winger Mastriano for governor, while Democrats nominated their AG Shapiro. Democrats help set up Mastriano for the win. Shapiro is the likely next governor and is likely to sign a bill like that, it's in the Democrats blood.
"Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but not their own facts." - Daniel Patrick Moynihan

Re: Democratic Pennsylvania governor calls for closing gun show "loophole," etc.

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sikacz wrote: Wed May 18, 2022 9:52 pm That’s a bunch of BS. There’s not one FFL that I know that sells guns without a background check at gun shows. This is simply a dog whistle to go after private sales regardless of where they take place.
All true but what you DON'T need at gun shows is proof you are a FFL to have a table to sell your guns. Or the gent that is selling stuff out of the trunk of his car in a 'gun show' parking lot. Go to a gun show in Wyoming...buy a gun without a BGC..easy.
If my niece wants to buy one of my guns I should be able to sell it to her without an FFL.
Even in Colorado, sales to relatives don't require a BGC
UBC really should be universal. There is no reason for it not to be so.
Agree..but you'll get slammed, 'slippery slope', 'another nail in the coffin', 'Next are gun grabs'...etc...
To say that felons don't look for private sales to buy their guns is naive'.

Re: Democratic Pennsylvania governor calls for closing gun show "loophole," etc.

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UBCs seem good in theory. But honestly, I don’t see them having any meaningful impact on crime or active shooters. They don’t UPDATE the NICS enough; and many active shooters have clean records. Personally, I think they are an infringement. I buy private party firearms and ones through FFLs I don’t really have a preference other than availability.

UBCs are an infringement I can live with as long as they remove every other one, NFAs, suppressors, SBRs, carry restrictions, registration schemes, etc. however, the people purportedly calling for “common sense” gun laws have been exposed as in favor of complete disarmament. I don’t trust that UBCs that can later be used by an authoritarian government as a disarmament scheme. I’m not supporting disarmament in the face of a racist, authoritarian party seeking complete power.


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Re: Democratic Pennsylvania governor calls for closing gun show

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INVICTVS138 wrote: Thu May 19, 2022 5:30 pm UBCs seem good in theory. But honestly, I don’t see them having any meaningful impact on crime or active shooters. They don’t UPDATE the NICS enough; and many active shooters have clean records. Personally, I think they are an infringement. I buy private party firearms and ones through FFLs I don’t really have a preference other than availability.

UBCs are an infringement I can live with as long as they remove every other one, NFAs, suppressors, SBRs, carry restrictions, registration schemes, etc. however, the people purportedly calling for “common sense” gun laws have been exposed as in favor of complete disarmament. I don’t trust that UBCs that can later be used by an authoritarian government as a disarmament scheme. I’m not supporting disarmament in the face of a racist, authoritarian party seeking complete power.


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How would any federal government do that? A 'disarmament scheme'? 'Registration schemes'? Nobody today has any idea of who owns what...of the 400 MILLION+ guns owned in the US today. The 'line' from UBC to disarmament is a long and crooked one..doesn't really exist.
UBCs, while just looking at felonies, doesn't go far enough, IMHO. Most 'mass shooters', like the guy in Buffalo, the guy in Boulder, the tattoo shooter in Aurora, all bought their guns legally.

Re: Democratic Pennsylvania governor calls for closing gun show "loophole," etc.

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sig230 wrote: Fri May 20, 2022 9:02 am Authoritarian Governments would not need any UBCs to justify or implement a disarmament scheme.
The only argument against UBC is to have people afraid of confiscation. I agree with sig230. on edit, it's true that in order to deny the RKBA to someone, that someone had better be a violent felon, or a registered foreign agent or one of several other treasonous categories. Is it only the left who says that it's true that some people should not be allowed to own guns?

We can whine all we want that it's unconstitutional to have to pay to exercise a right. Sometimes it'll be that way, unfortunately. Actually, the biggest cost is for the weapon anyway. Even if fifty bucks' fees are added, a person could save up. What I'm saying is let's get realistic. "They" already know about our guns. This is not really all that pertinent in the large scheme of things.

CDFingers
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If I had a gun for every ace I've drawn
I could arm a town the size of Zhytomyr

Re: Democratic Pennsylvania governor calls for closing gun show "loophole," etc.

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The problem I really have with the ever increasing layering of gun laws is that they are all take and no give. If we can discern that something is working, let's focus on making that something work better and reducing the burdens on things that are not working in any statistically measurable way. So, if we decide UBCs work but have some reporting problems, let's fix those things. If UBC ensures no nuts or violent people can legally purchase gus, we can drop the other shit that controls things. One gun thing is not inherently more dangerous than another gun thing. So, my ire with gun control isn't so much that some control isn't a good idea. It's that layer upon layer upon layer does become an infringement, does become ridiculous, does treat the law abiding as latent criminals. We will never be able to legislate away criminal activities surrounding guns unless we figure out how to make people less violent.

Re: Democratic Pennsylvania governor calls for closing gun show "loophole," etc.

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See, there it is, the connection. Since it's people who do the violence (the premise we need to support), then it makes sense to prohibit violent folks from legally buying a gun. It's the gun that lets them kill many and at a distance. Since requirements already exist, we add a few more with respect to crimes--because it's people who do the violence. You regulate the people by treating them. If treatment is unsuccessful, they're prohibited.

CDFingers
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If I had a gun for every ace I've drawn
I could arm a town the size of Zhytomyr

Re: Democratic Pennsylvania governor calls for closing gun show "loophole," etc.

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featureless wrote: Fri May 20, 2022 9:49 am It's that layer upon layer upon layer does become an infringement, does become ridiculous, does treat the law abiding as latent criminals. We will never be able to legislate away criminal activities surrounding guns unless we figure out how to make people less violent.
Sadly it's become a feeding frenzy among Democrats, write a bill and make emotional pleas to convince other legislators to vote for your new gun restrictions. Campaign on bills you've written, not bills that have become law. Facts don't enter into it, Democrats and Republicans operate the same way. I have no problem with UBCs because it's supposed to prevent felons from legally purchasing a firearm, but most felons caught with firearms didn't obtain them legally. I support safe storage where there are children in the home. I'm not convinced that waiting periods prevent suicide or domestic violence, especially a 10 day waiting period like CA requires for each gun.

Yes we're way off the mark of preventing violence whether with a gun or any weapon or even fists.
"Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but not their own facts." - Daniel Patrick Moynihan

Re: Democratic Pennsylvania governor calls for closing gun show "loophole," etc.

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highdesert wrote: Fri May 20, 2022 10:46 am
featureless wrote: Fri May 20, 2022 9:49 am It's that layer upon layer upon layer does become an infringement, does become ridiculous, does treat the law abiding as latent criminals. We will never be able to legislate away criminal activities surrounding guns unless we figure out how to make people less violent.
Sadly it's become a feeding frenzy among Democrats, write a bill and make emotional pleas to convince other legislators to vote for your new gun restrictions. Campaign on bills you've written, not bills that have become law. Facts don't enter into it, Democrats and Republicans operate the same way. I have no problem with UBCs because it's supposed to prevent felons from legally purchasing a firearm, but most felons caught with firearms didn't obtain them legally. I support safe storage where there are children in the home. I'm not convinced that waiting periods prevent suicide or domestic violence, especially a 10 day waiting period like CA requires for each gun.

Yes we're way off the mark of preventing violence whether with a gun or any weapon or even fists.
What type gun did Timothy McVeigh and Terry Nichols use?
To be vintage it must be older than me!
Stories coming to you from Deep South Texas!
The next gun I buy will be the next to last gun I ever buy. PROMISE!

Re: Democratic Pennsylvania governor calls for closing gun show "loophole," etc.

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sig230 wrote: Fri May 20, 2022 10:51 am
highdesert wrote: Fri May 20, 2022 10:46 am
featureless wrote: Fri May 20, 2022 9:49 am It's that layer upon layer upon layer does become an infringement, does become ridiculous, does treat the law abiding as latent criminals. We will never be able to legislate away criminal activities surrounding guns unless we figure out how to make people less violent.
Sadly it's become a feeding frenzy among Democrats, write a bill and make emotional pleas to convince other legislators to vote for your new gun restrictions. Campaign on bills you've written, not bills that have become law. Facts don't enter into it, Democrats and Republicans operate the same way. I have no problem with UBCs because it's supposed to prevent felons from legally purchasing a firearm, but most felons caught with firearms didn't obtain them legally. I support safe storage where there are children in the home. I'm not convinced that waiting periods prevent suicide or domestic violence, especially a 10 day waiting period like CA requires for each gun.

Yes we're way off the mark of preventing violence whether with a gun or any weapon or even fists.
What type gun did Timothy McVeigh and Terry Nichols use?
Exactly !
"Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but not their own facts." - Daniel Patrick Moynihan

Re: Democratic Pennsylvania governor calls for closing gun show "loophole," etc.

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Same with the 19 hijackers: what gun? See? It's the person. Yet many cry for more and different gun laws. When you put a genuine UBC in place, you can filter bad guys out who want to buy legally. This lets gun owners say, "We've done as much as we can. " Then we can say, "It's up to Congress to make legislation that pays for treatment, the kind of treatment that prevents bad guys from wanting to kill others." And that it's up to Congress to make laws for an equitable society. These are things behind the root cause mitigation ideas.

CDFingers
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If I had a gun for every ace I've drawn
I could arm a town the size of Zhytomyr

Re: Democratic Pennsylvania governor calls for closing gun show "loophole," etc.

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sikacz wrote: Wed May 18, 2022 9:52 pm That’s a bunch of BS. There’s not one FFL that I know that sells guns without a background check at gun shows. This is simply a dog whistle to go after private sales regardless of where they take place.
I was hesitating buying a gun at a gun store booth at a gun show. The salesman offered to change it to a "private sale" to close the deal. He even winked during his offer.

Re: Democratic Pennsylvania governor calls for closing gun show "loophole," etc.

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jschmidt wrote: Fri May 20, 2022 5:17 pm
sikacz wrote: Wed May 18, 2022 9:52 pm That’s a bunch of BS. There’s not one FFL that I know that sells guns without a background check at gun shows. This is simply a dog whistle to go after private sales regardless of where they take place.
I was hesitating buying a gun at a gun store booth at a gun show. The salesman offered to change it to a "private sale" to close the deal. He even winked during his offer.
Did you report him, I would have. Never experienced anything like it and don’t believe it’s a “mega” problem that needs solving. My stance, address root causes assholes (elected representatives).
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"Resistance is futile. You will be assimilated!" Loquacious of many. Texas Chapter Chief Cat Herder.

Re: Democratic Pennsylvania governor calls for closing gun show "loophole," etc.

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jschmidt wrote: Fri May 20, 2022 5:17 pm
sikacz wrote: Wed May 18, 2022 9:52 pm That’s a bunch of BS. There’s not one FFL that I know that sells guns without a background check at gun shows. This is simply a dog whistle to go after private sales regardless of where they take place.
I was hesitating buying a gun at a gun store booth at a gun show. The salesman offered to change it to a "private sale" to close the deal. He even winked during his offer.
But, but, but, that never happens, right? I watched a video of a guy at a COLORADO gun show, walk out to the gent's car, open the trunk and sell him an AR for $400....

There are people walking all over with little signs on their jacket or gun..private sales and most DO perform a BGC, many do not..My son sold his Taurus snubbie that way.

"sounds good, how about we go outside to seal the deal'...

2 issues here...regulating the 'tool' or regulating the 'person'..these are mixed all the time under 'gun laws'. A 'better' BGC 'system' is needed, IMHO...because I think we most all agree..some people are easily buying lotsa guns who probably shouldn't be owning them.
I agree regulating the tool does mostly nothing..considering the WIDE variety of guns available and that are already in the hands of 'the people'...
Last edited by F4FEver on Sat May 21, 2022 8:49 am, edited 1 time in total.

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