vulnerable GPS system

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"As intentional and unintentional GPS disruptions are on the rise, experts warn that our over reliance on the technology is courting disaster, but they are divided on what to do about it."


https://www.nytimes.com/2021/01/23/opin ... ycxgg_MFFg
All religions united with government are more or less inimical to liberty. All, separated from government, are compatible with liberty.-Henry Clay
Both oligarch and tyrant mistrust the people, and therefore deprive them of their arms.—Aristotle

Re: vulnerable GPS system

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I know my Garmin seems to be stoned a lot as of late. Even though I may know where I'm going, I use for traffic info. She often gives me instructions that make me tend to believe she has absolutely no idea where I am - I don't need help in that department.
"Being Republican is more than a difference of opinion - it's a character flaw." "COVID can fix STUPID!"
The greatest, most aggrieved mistake EVER made by USA was electing DJT as POTUS - TWICE!!!!!

Re: vulnerable GPS system

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YankeeTarheel wrote: Mon Feb 01, 2021 10:15 am
lurker wrote: Mon Feb 01, 2021 10:10 am sun rises in the east. if i don't know where i am, i call it "an adventure"
I always know where I am. I just don't always know where "am" is! :see_stars: :roflmao:
I consider myself lucky if I can navigate to the coffee pot in the morning. Once I found myself out in the reloading shack because that's where I thought I'd left my coffee cup--from two weeks ago.

CDFingers
Crazy cat peekin' through a lace bandana
like a one-eyed Cheshire, like a diamond-eye Jack

Re: vulnerable GPS system

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Losing GPS would definitely be a social disruption but the primary issue is to identify what is critical and what is just nice to have. We need to have a plan "B", "C", "D", ..., "Zed" for those things that are mission critical, air traffic control, airplane and boat navigation systems, utility systems and a fail system for things like autonomous cars and trucks where they pull off the road, stop, and call home with their last known location should they lose GPS communication.

Systems like cell phones need a secondary replacement system like ask your neighbor and accurate location specific clocks.

Most of all we need to have a rainy day fund set aside to mitigate the lower end financial losses like unemployment insurance. The big financial risks like the stock market or international banking need to be regulated to assure they set aside a reasonable amount of resources and funding to mitigate against disruption.
To be vintage it must be older than me!
The next gun I buy will be the next to last gun I ever buy. PROMISE!
jim

Re: vulnerable GPS system

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Quote from article for those that didn't read it:

"If GPS was knocked out, he said, you’d notice. Think widespread power outages, financial markets seizing up and the transportation system grinding to a halt. Grocers would be unable to stock their shelves, and Amazon would go dark. Emergency responders wouldn’t be able to find you, and forget about using your cellphone."

And your teenagers can use spoofing software so you don't know where they've been.
All religions united with government are more or less inimical to liberty. All, separated from government, are compatible with liberty.-Henry Clay
Both oligarch and tyrant mistrust the people, and therefore deprive them of their arms.—Aristotle

Re: vulnerable GPS system

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CDFingers wrote: Mon Feb 01, 2021 10:41 am
YankeeTarheel wrote: Mon Feb 01, 2021 10:15 am
lurker wrote: Mon Feb 01, 2021 10:10 am sun rises in the east. if i don't know where i am, i call it "an adventure"
I always know where I am. I just don't always know where "am" is! :see_stars: :roflmao:
I consider myself lucky if I can navigate to the coffee pot in the morning. Once I found myself out in the reloading shack because that's where I thought I'd left my coffee cup--from two weeks ago.

CDFingers
"Tumble outta bed
And I stumble to the kitchen
Pour myself a cup of ambition
And yawn and stretch and try to come to life" --"9 to 5" by Dolly Parton
"Even if the bee could explain to the fly why pollen is better than shit, the fly could never understand."

Re: vulnerable GPS system

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YankeeTarheel wrote: Mon Feb 01, 2021 12:58 pm Tying this to the crazy pharmacist in Wisconsin who deliberately spoiled 500 vaccine doses also believing in a flat earth....Who needs GPS on a flat Earth?
How else are you going to find the end edge?? :whistle:
"Being Republican is more than a difference of opinion - it's a character flaw." "COVID can fix STUPID!"
The greatest, most aggrieved mistake EVER made by USA was electing DJT as POTUS - TWICE!!!!!

Re: vulnerable GPS system

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Good article, hopefully it's a priority with the Biden administration.
Of course, business interests that rely on GPS want a backup that’s just as good as the original, just as accessible and also free.
More than 10,000 incidents of GPS interference have been linked to China and Russia in the past five years. Ship captains have reported GPS errors showing them 20-120 miles inland when they were actually sailing off the coast of Russia in the Black Sea. Also well documented are ships suddenly disappearing from navigation screens while maneuvering in the Port of Shanghai. After GPS disruptions at Tel Aviv’s Ben Gurion Airport in 2019, Israeli officials pointed to Syria, where Russia has been involved in the nation’s long-running civil war. And last summer, the United States Space Command accused Russia of testing antisatellite weaponry.
Eleven potential systems were tested, including eLoran, a low-frequency, high-power timing and navigation system transmitted from terrestrial towers at Coast Guard facilities throughout the United States.

“China, Russia, Iran, South Korea and Saudi Arabia all have eLoran systems because they don’t want to be as vulnerable as we are to disruptions of signals from space,” said Dana Goward, the president of the Resilient Navigation and Timing Foundation, a nonprofit that advocates for the implementation of an eLoran backup for GPS.
Also under consideration by federal authorities are timing systems delivered via fiber optic network and satellite systems in a lower orbit than GPS, which therefore have a stronger signal, making them harder to hack. A report on the technologies was submitted to Congress last week.
And our smartphones that do almost everything for us and have a compass but it's GPS.
"Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but not their own facts." - Daniel Patrick Moynihan

Re: vulnerable GPS system

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highdesert wrote: Mon Feb 01, 2021 2:29 pm And our smartphones that do almost everything for us and have a compass but it's GPS.
But can also do location by triangulation measuring the return time from the three closest towers.
To be vintage it must be older than me!
The next gun I buy will be the next to last gun I ever buy. PROMISE!
jim

Re: vulnerable GPS system

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Hiker wrote: Mon Feb 01, 2021 12:31 pm Quote from article for those that didn't read it:

"If GPS was knocked out, he said, you’d notice. Think widespread power outages, financial markets seizing up and the transportation system grinding to a halt. Grocers would be unable to stock their shelves, and Amazon would go dark. Emergency responders wouldn’t be able to find you, and forget about using your cellphone."

And your teenagers can use spoofing software so you don't know where they've been.
I suspect GPS is also the Achilles heel of our military. I wonder how many of them can read and navigate with a paper map and compass.
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"Resistance is futile. You will be assimilated!" Loquacious of many. Texas Chapter Chief Cat Herder.

Re: vulnerable GPS system

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Wino wrote: Mon Feb 01, 2021 1:14 pm
YankeeTarheel wrote: Mon Feb 01, 2021 12:58 pm Tying this to the crazy pharmacist in Wisconsin who deliberately spoiled 500 vaccine doses also believing in a flat earth....Who needs GPS on a flat Earth?
How else are you going to find the end edge?? :whistle:
The wonderful main character of "The Gods Must Be Crazy" had NO problem finding the Edge of the Earth without any technology at all!
"Even if the bee could explain to the fly why pollen is better than shit, the fly could never understand."

Re: vulnerable GPS system

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Bucolic wrote: Mon Feb 01, 2021 3:17 pm I’m good with a compass as long as I have a network connection to get the local declination. That old magnetic pole thang always had me flummoxed - which way is positive?
I have several old Suunto compasses. One is a Finnish military one from WW2 and another I used in scouting. Both will do me fine. Yes, have old maps as well. LoL.
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"Resistance is futile. You will be assimilated!" Loquacious of many. Texas Chapter Chief Cat Herder.

Re: vulnerable GPS system

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sikacz wrote: Mon Feb 01, 2021 4:44 pm
Bucolic wrote: Mon Feb 01, 2021 3:17 pm I’m good with a compass as long as I have a network connection to get the local declination. That old magnetic pole thang always had me flummoxed - which way is positive?
I have several old Suunto compasses. One is a Finnish military one from WW2 and another I used in scouting. Both will do me fine. Yes, have old maps as well. LoL.
Have you ever seen a celestial or astro compass? The US Army Air Corp and the RAF used this gadget, an MKII. It's similar in function to a sextant, and was used when magnetic compasses fail near the poles. A bit tricky to use but don't depend on magnetism.
AstroCompass.JPG
"Even if the bee could explain to the fly why pollen is better than shit, the fly could never understand."

Re: vulnerable GPS system

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YankeeTarheel wrote: Mon Feb 01, 2021 4:58 pm
sikacz wrote: Mon Feb 01, 2021 4:44 pm
Bucolic wrote: Mon Feb 01, 2021 3:17 pm I’m good with a compass as long as I have a network connection to get the local declination. That old magnetic pole thang always had me flummoxed - which way is positive?
I have several old Suunto compasses. One is a Finnish military one from WW2 and another I used in scouting. Both will do me fine. Yes, have old maps as well. LoL.
Have you ever seen a celestial or astro compass? The US Army Air Corp and the RAF used this gadget, an MKII. It's similar in function to a sextant, and was used when magnetic compasses fail near the poles. A bit tricky to use but don't depend on magnetism.

AstroCompass.JPG
Pretty awesome. Won’t fit on my wrist though! LoL.
Image
Image

"Resistance is futile. You will be assimilated!" Loquacious of many. Texas Chapter Chief Cat Herder.

Re: vulnerable GPS system

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sikacz wrote: Mon Feb 01, 2021 5:07 pm
YankeeTarheel wrote: Mon Feb 01, 2021 4:58 pm
sikacz wrote: Mon Feb 01, 2021 4:44 pm
Bucolic wrote: Mon Feb 01, 2021 3:17 pm I’m good with a compass as long as I have a network connection to get the local declination. That old magnetic pole thang always had me flummoxed - which way is positive?
I have several old Suunto compasses. One is a Finnish military one from WW2 and another I used in scouting. Both will do me fine. Yes, have old maps as well. LoL.
Have you ever seen a celestial or astro compass? The US Army Air Corp and the RAF used this gadget, an MKII. It's similar in function to a sextant, and was used when magnetic compasses fail near the poles. A bit tricky to use but don't depend on magnetism.

AstroCompass.JPG
Pretty awesome. Won’t fit on my wrist though! LoL.
use 2 straps instead of one--but don't try to put your hand in your pocket.
"Even if the bee could explain to the fly why pollen is better than shit, the fly could never understand."

Re: vulnerable GPS system

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YankeeTarheel wrote: Mon Feb 01, 2021 5:47 pm
sikacz wrote: Mon Feb 01, 2021 5:07 pm
YankeeTarheel wrote: Mon Feb 01, 2021 4:58 pm
sikacz wrote: Mon Feb 01, 2021 4:44 pm
I have several old Suunto compasses. One is a Finnish military one from WW2 and another I used in scouting. Both will do me fine. Yes, have old maps as well. LoL.
Have you ever seen a celestial or astro compass? The US Army Air Corp and the RAF used this gadget, an MKII. It's similar in function to a sextant, and was used when magnetic compasses fail near the poles. A bit tricky to use but don't depend on magnetism.

AstroCompass.JPG
Pretty awesome. Won’t fit on my wrist though! LoL.
use 2 straps instead of one--but don't try to put your hand in your pocket.
:roflmao:
Image
Image

"Resistance is futile. You will be assimilated!" Loquacious of many. Texas Chapter Chief Cat Herder.

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