The Liberal Gun Club Forum

So apparently the Dayton shooter used a .223. Now the media is going on about "high powered assault weapons" and specifically mentioning the .223. OK so I am admittedly very much a noob at all this, but does the .223 qualify as a "high powered" round? I shot a couple firearms of that caliber the other day and they barely had a kick to them. Why would they go after the .223, when that would leave pretty much only higher calibers to a whack job's disposal? Or are they going after the .223 so they can ban anything "higher powered" than that?

Why did we attack Iraq in response to 9-11? Because reasons.

I"m not the expert here, but It's the civilian version of the round used in the military's M16 and M4 battle rifles, the 5.56x45mm NATO round. Usually rifles rated for the 5.56 can shoot the .223, but not vice-versa. In general, I believe the 5.56x45 is a hotter round.

Hope that helps.

“High powered” sounds scary. They have no idea about the specifics of what guns actually are.

Technically 223/556 and 7.62x39 are “intermediate power” cartridges, but also AR15s are used in a military based target rifle discipline called “high power”

Basically, like most of American politics and public discourse, the ideas that words mean things and facts can be verified is pretty old fashioned.

The media and politicians have designate it a "high powered round" because it fits the narrative of "military style" and must be banned. While even the lowly 22 is deadly, the .223 is hardly high powered when compared to most other rifle rounds. 338 Lapua is high powered. 308 is high powered. .223 is nothing in comparison if we're talking actual power. They are all equally deadly. But then so is a pencil in the eye.

Marlene wrote: Tue Aug 06, 2019 9:20 pm Basically, like most of American politics and public discourse, the ideas that words mean things and facts can be verified is pretty old fashioned.

And this. Most definitely this.

Eventually they will realize what "high powered" really is and they will just declare everything to be high powered. Hunters who think no one is coming for *their* guns are sadly mistaken.

Eris wrote: Tue Aug 06, 2019 10:00 pm Eventually they will realize what "high powered" really is and they will just declare everything to be high powered. Hunters who think no one is coming for *their* guns are sadly mistaken.

Yup. Common vernacular will refer to those as "sniper rifles" in the next few years

Significantly less power than my caplock... uh oh!

Marlene wrote: Tue Aug 06, 2019 10:17 pm Significantly less power than my caplock... uh oh!

Caplocks didn't exist at the time the 2nd amendment was written. You'll just have to settle for a musket.

Eris wrote: Tue Aug 06, 2019 10:29 pm

Marlene wrote: Tue Aug 06, 2019 10:17 pm Significantly less power than my caplock... uh oh!

Caplocks didn't exist at the time the 2nd amendment was written. You'll just have to settle for a musket.

Can I have the Italian air rifle instead? It went into service in 1780.

Eris wrote: Tue Aug 06, 2019 10:00 pm Eventually they will realize what "high powered" really is and they will just declare everything to be high powered. Hunters who think no one is coming for *their* guns are sadly mistaken.

Yeah this is basically what I was thinking. I haven't shot much beyond my .22 and my shotgun, but I wouldn't call the .223 high powered, it didn't even raise a puff on the backstop at the range at 100 yards, and had considerably less kick than any shotgun.

Eris wrote: Tue Aug 06, 2019 10:29 pm

Marlene wrote: Tue Aug 06, 2019 10:17 pm Significantly less power than my caplock... uh oh!

Caplocks didn't exist at the time the 2nd amendment was written. You'll just have to settle for a musket.

I like flint too.

Eris wrote: Tue Aug 06, 2019 10:29 pm

Marlene wrote: Tue Aug 06, 2019 10:17 pm Significantly less power than my caplock... uh oh!

Caplocks didn't exist at the time the 2nd amendment was written. You'll just have to settle for a musket.

Archives show that in 1718 the Royal patent office in London issued the first known patent for a "machine gun". The Puckle, 2 versions one that fired round balls and one that fired squared projectiles. The square one was to be used on Turks and Saracens. I'd probably get the square one first since that will be the 1st one banned.

States that don't allow deer hunting with .223 diameter bullet or an AR-15 rifle are Colorado, Connecticut, Illinois, Iowa, Massachusetts, Virginia, Ohio, New Jersey, Washington, and West Virginia... .223 is not considered powerful enough to reliably make a humane kill on a 100-250 lb animal.

"Armed Misogynist" was not scary enough or something.

Since the AR-15 and the .223 is clearly an assault weapon of war with a deadlier bullet than a handgun, that's why I decided to stay away from it and instead...
Got an AR-10 that shoots .308 and only came with a 5 round magazine (the legal hunting limit). And because we all know that plastic stocks, black lower receivers, and perforated metal foreends make the gun much more deadly (looking) I got wood furniture and a Coyote Brown cerakote, which is much less scary and safer. And I bought 4 Magpul 10 round magazines to go with it. One is full loaded, with super-deadly .308 ... snapcaps.

It is difficult to explain to someone that the civilian AR-15 or the US semiauto version of the AK was actually never used by armies in war. Bolt action rifles... some of those were weapons of war. It is frustrating. I find it hard to take someone talking AWB seriously when they don't care to understand anything about firearms.

Most of them define the Ruger 10/22 as an "assault weapon" for their purposes.

They are no different than those who absolutely believed Obama was a foreigner who faked his birth certificate.
"My mind's made up! Don't confuse me with facts!"

The "no-fly list" and "" argument is one of my favorite.

1. If you are placed on a secret list with no due process or advance knowledge, they argue that you shouldn't be able to buy a gun.

2. If you try to buy a gun and are denied, you should be arrested.

Do they really trust the government with this much power? When you are placed on the secret list, no one will save you.

K9s wrote: Fri Aug 09, 2019 12:00 am The "no-fly list" and "" argument is one of my favorite.

1. If you are placed on a secret list with no due process or advance knowledge, they argue that you shouldn't be able to buy a gun.

2. If you try to buy a gun and are denied, you should be arrested.

Do they really trust the government with this much power? When you are placed on the secret list, no one will save you.

It's amazing how much power people will allow the government when they believe they aren't subject to that power.

senorgrand wrote: Fri Aug 09, 2019 12:09 am

K9s wrote: Fri Aug 09, 2019 12:00 am The "no-fly list" and "" argument is one of my favorite.

1. If you are placed on a secret list with no due process or advance knowledge, they argue that you shouldn't be able to buy a gun.

2. If you try to buy a gun and are denied, you should be arrested.

Do they really trust the government with this much power? When you are placed on the secret list, no one will save you.

It's amazing how much power people will allow the government when they believe they aren't subject to that power.

On fark.com, there's a saying: When I voted for the face eating leopard party I didin't think the leopards would eat *my* face!

YankeeTarheel wrote: Thu Aug 08, 2019 11:46 pm They are no different than those who absolutely believed Obama was a foreigner who faked his birth certificate.
"My mind's made up! Don't confuse me with facts!"

Fuck was that a difficult time being around republicans. The same people would think a killer asteroid was heading towards earth. Source: info wars or Jeff rense.

Eris wrote: Fri Aug 09, 2019 12:11 am

senorgrand wrote: Fri Aug 09, 2019 12:09 am

K9s wrote: Fri Aug 09, 2019 12:00 am The "no-fly list" and "" argument is one of my favorite.

1. If you are placed on a secret list with no due process or advance knowledge, they argue that you shouldn't be able to buy a gun.

2. If you try to buy a gun and are denied, you should be arrested.

Do they really trust the government with this much power? When you are placed on the secret list, no one will save you.

It's amazing how much power people will allow the government when they believe they aren't subject to that power.

On fark.com, there's a saying: When I voted for the face eating leopard party I didin't think the leopards would eat *my* face!

Amazing news that, years later, a court rules that the Watch List is unconstitutional. Now we know why. A Local PD or someone else could add you to the list with no evidence. And HRC wanted to use that list to deny gun rights. No one is innocent in this nonsense.