Wino wrote: Fri May 31, 2019 12:16 pm ...............and what Obama thinks about guns is important - why??

To copy the format above, ;-)

1) It will be reported.
2) It will be believed.
3) That belief in false information will create support for gun control legislation.

Context matters. When a politician in the context of a speech with the premise that gun control is too lax, says "you can buy a gun over the internet" -- the clear implication is that it is mind-boggling that a person can just order up a gun and have it delivered. We know that isn't the case but if you brought this up like that with non-gun owners unfamiliar with guns, they'd think it is nuts too. Imagine the different response levels you'd get with a poll question like this:

1. Do you think people should be able to buy guns on the internet?
(answer will be emphatically "NO")

2. Do you think people should be able to buy guns on the internet if the gun is NOT shipped directly to the buyer, but instead to a licensed dealer who runs the normal Federal and if applicable, state background checks before turning the gun over to the buyer and if the buyer fails the background check(s), the dealer will not turn the gun over to the buyer?
(answer is going to be some proportion of NO and YES depending on how rabidly anti-gun any particular person is)

and for the real data on what people understand, ask a third:

3. Would you support passage of a law which accomplishes what is described in Question 2?
(I bet a lot of people would not realizing that that actually already is the law)

Bullitt68 wrote: Sun Jun 02, 2019 12:47 pm

hondo2K0 wrote: Sun Jun 02, 2019 12:24 am Obama never was a gun guy so give him some credit there, now idea that one can buy a machine gun of the internet is ridiculous as it implies that one can buy it without any background check. You can buy a machine gun in the shop but first ATF/DOJ has to approve you and you have to pay 200 dollar tax and engrave a gun with your name and state.

Since 1986 only twice fully automatic legally owned weapons were used once by gun shop owner who defended his store from criminals who broke into the store and once by a cop who killed his informant I think he is still in the prison.

OH MY GOD!! LOL
I have a friend who lives in NEV and his dad (dirt farmer) loved guns, after he passed they opened his trunk and low an behold there was a machine gun. So he had to go get a class 3 , no problem he said. Gotta get up there and shoot it in their pit range.

Simply put your sorry is a huge load of Horse shit

People win the lottery. Lots of people have won the lottery. Lots of people have won lots of money from the lottery.

In reality this is little justification for buying lottery tickets.

The safe bet is you aren't going to win the lottery.

Again, citizens can own machine guns, but to infer one can order a firearm, much less a machine gun, over the internet is greatly simplifying a complex process to the point it is more incorrect than correct.

The lotto is a tax on people that can't add...

SR

Right no new machine guns only old ones. Unless your a LEO of some type.

Politifact: Barack Obama wrong on limits of US gun laws, machine gun sales

The assertion that anybody can buy a weapon flies in the face of the many types of people, from felons to drug abusers to spouse abusers, who may not buy weapons. Internet sales are legal, as he said, and they take place under the same rules that govern other gun sales.

As for machine guns, they are strictly illegal, with the exception under legal controls of models from 1986 and earlier.

Taking the elements of his statement together, we rate this claim Mostly False.

DispositionMatrix wrote: Wed Jun 05, 2019 10:43 am Politifact: Barack Obama wrong on limits of US gun laws, machine gun sales

The assertion that anybody can buy a weapon flies in the face of the many types of people, from felons to drug abusers to spouse abusers, who may not buy weapons. Internet sales are legal, as he said, and they take place under the same rules that govern other gun sales.

As for machine guns, they are strictly illegal, with the exception under legal controls of models from 1986 and earlier.

Taking the elements of his statement together, we rate this claim Mostly False.

Glad they analyzed it, Fact Check . org is a service of the Annenberg Center of the University of Pennsylvania. Obama's speech looks like it was written by Everytown or Moms, we know they get facts wrong. He needs to replace the aide who wrote that speech.

highdesert wrote: Fri Jun 07, 2019 8:26 am

DispositionMatrix wrote: Wed Jun 05, 2019 10:43 am Politifact: Barack Obama wrong on limits of US gun laws, machine gun sales

The assertion that anybody can buy a weapon flies in the face of the many types of people, from felons to drug abusers to spouse abusers, who may not buy weapons. Internet sales are legal, as he said, and they take place under the same rules that govern other gun sales.

As for machine guns, they are strictly illegal, with the exception under legal controls of models from 1986 and earlier.

Taking the elements of his statement together, we rate this claim Mostly False.

Glad they analyzed it, Fact Check . org is a service of the Annenberg Center of the University of Pennsylvania. Obama's speech looks like it was written by Everytown or Moms, we know they get facts wrong. He needs to replace the aide who wrote that speech.

Why would he even want to do that?

DispositionMatrix wrote: Fri Jun 07, 2019 8:36 am

highdesert wrote: Fri Jun 07, 2019 8:26 am

DispositionMatrix wrote: Wed Jun 05, 2019 10:43 am Politifact: Barack Obama wrong on limits of US gun laws, machine gun sales

The assertion that anybody can buy a weapon flies in the face of the many types of people, from felons to drug abusers to spouse abusers, who may not buy weapons. Internet sales are legal, as he said, and they take place under the same rules that govern other gun sales.

As for machine guns, they are strictly illegal, with the exception under legal controls of models from 1986 and earlier.

Taking the elements of his statement together, we rate this claim Mostly False.

Glad they analyzed it, Fact Check . org is a service of the Annenberg Center of the University of Pennsylvania. Obama's speech looks like it was written by Everytown or Moms, we know they get facts wrong. He needs to replace the aide who wrote that speech.

Why would he even want to do that?

It's a new era with Donnie the Liar, there are a lot more fact checkers since he was in the WH.

This is a good thread, showing that critical thinking and fact checking are still things. Hondo did not offer any support for his crack, so that post can be discounted. The rest are really good, especially the observations about misinformation and how they offer false support for gun control laws, that misinformation indeed does influence things so must be opposed. Glad for fact check sites. I wish everyone would consult them before going off half cocked, as it were.

CDFingers

CDFingers wrote: Fri Jun 07, 2019 10:36 am This is a good thread, showing that critical thinking and fact checking are still things. Hondo did not offer any support for his crack, so that post can be discounted. The rest are really good, especially the observations about misinformation and how they offer false support for gun control laws, that misinformation indeed does influence things so must be opposed. Glad for fact check sites. I wish everyone would consult them before going off half cocked, as it were.

CDFingers

+1 for fact checkers

https://guides.lib.berkeley.edu/c.php?g ... &p=4333407

Good link.

CDFingers

"As for machine guns, they are strictly illegal, with the exception under legal controls of models from 1986 and earlier."

Pretty sure I mentioned that already. Still can order one and have it sent to a FFL. So mostly true.
Link just proves factcheck has people that can't research and has poor reading Comprehension.
Again I didn't see where he said one needn't have a license.

Hold up. If you consider that, before the ban, you could order a bump stock over the internet and turn your AR into a “machine gun” (I know, I know) then what President Obama said has some nugget of truth.

Mostly I’m in no mood to criticize my favorite president EVER.

CDFingers wrote: Fri Jun 07, 2019 10:36 am This is a good thread, showing that critical thinking and fact checking are still things. Hondo did not offer any support for his crack, so that post can be discounted. The rest are really good, especially the observations about misinformation and how they offer false support for gun control laws, that misinformation indeed does influence things so must be opposed. Glad for fact check sites. I wish everyone would consult them before going off half cocked, as it were.

CDFingers

I made it clear on page 1 of this tread how one can buy a machine gun.
As far as story about finding a machine gun in the trunk and making it legal in last few decades it is a load of horse shit. Couple years ago, somebody dumped a bunch of heavy machine guns, submachine guns etc. in the some creek somewhere in Ohio or Iowa ( I am not sure about exact location) and cops figured out that somebody probably was renovating house or cleaning it for sale and found bunch of WWII guns without any paperwork and decided to rid of it

hondo2K0 wrote: Sat Jun 08, 2019 4:05 am

CDFingers wrote: Fri Jun 07, 2019 10:36 am This is a good thread, showing that critical thinking and fact checking are still things. Hondo did not offer any support for his crack, so that post can be discounted. The rest are really good, especially the observations about misinformation and how they offer false support for gun control laws, that misinformation indeed does influence things so must be opposed. Glad for fact check sites. I wish everyone would consult them before going off half cocked, as it were.

CDFingers

I made it clear on page 1 of this tread how one can buy a machine gun.
As far as story about finding a machine gun in the trunk and making it legal in last few decades it is a load of horse shit. Couple years ago, somebody dumped a bunch of heavy machine guns, submachine guns etc. in the some creek somewhere in Ohio or Iowa ( I am not sure about exact location) and cops figured out that somebody probably was renovating house or cleaning it for sale and found bunch of WWII guns without any paperwork and decided to rid of it

Folks can claim or say anything--witness the orange slime, so saying or claiming don't mean squat. Had you provided clear support, though, you would have posted this link

https://www.atf.gov/firearms/docs/trans ... s/download

But you didn't, so you weren't. Don't fret. It happens.

CDFingers

Like this? And it was already resistered to his dad. Yawn.... this thread is getting boring.

"The firearms may be transferred on a tax-exempt basis to a lawful heir. The executor would
apply on ATF Form 5, Application for Tax Exempt Transfer and Registration of a Firearm, for a
tax-exempt transfer to a lawful heir."

CDFingers wrote: Sat Jun 08, 2019 9:19 am

hondo2K0 wrote: Sat Jun 08, 2019 4:05 am

CDFingers wrote: Fri Jun 07, 2019 10:36 am This is a good thread, showing that critical thinking and fact checking are still things. Hondo did not offer any support for his crack, so that post can be discounted. The rest are really good, especially the observations about misinformation and how they offer false support for gun control laws, that misinformation indeed does influence things so must be opposed. Glad for fact check sites. I wish everyone would consult them before going off half cocked, as it were.

CDFingers

I made it clear on page 1 of this tread how one can buy a machine gun.
As far as story about finding a machine gun in the trunk and making it legal in last few decades it is a load of horse shit. Couple years ago, somebody dumped a bunch of heavy machine guns, submachine guns etc. in the some creek somewhere in Ohio or Iowa ( I am not sure about exact location) and cops figured out that somebody probably was renovating house or cleaning it for sale and found bunch of WWII guns without any paperwork and decided to rid of it

Folks can claim or say anything--witness the orange slime, so saying or claiming don't mean squat. Had you provided clear support, though, you would have posted this link

https://www.atf.gov/firearms/docs/trans ... s/download

But you didn't, so you weren't. Don't fret. It happens.

CDFingers

No offense but I do not spoon-feed my children info, nor I am here to write APA papers and cite my sources. OK? So keep grading rubrics for yourself.

Roger that. Rules are for losers and folks who want to communicate.

CDFingers