Venezuela went from one of, if not THE most prosperous Country in SA, to a Humanitarian Disaster.

Now, if they had been hit by a Plague, Volcanic Eruption, or Extinction-Event Asteroid, I suppose we could all understand that.

I don't believe their troubles are even due to a Race War, or Religious War.

WHAT HAPPENED ?

Socialism. Is that the answer you wanted?
You aren’t very subtle.

A one-word answer ?

No, I am certainly looking for more than that.

The NAZIS described themselves as Socialists.

They were immoral murderers, but until they attempted to conquer Europe, and we resisted, they certainly fed their people.

No, one word is not an answer.

Maybe you don't know ?

I do not either.

Would we both be wise to find out ?

Oh jeez!
A little history lesson, but I'm now convinced our new "member" is, indeed, a troll, here to disrupt the LIBERAL Gun Club.

The Nazis were National Socialists. Prior to their taking over the Weimar government there were two factions, the NATIONAL socialists, and the national SOCIALISTS. Hitler was of the former and the latter was PURGED from the NSDAP (National Socialist German Workers Party--the official name and anagram in German). Neither faction were Marxist and both detested Marxism.
Marxist Socialism is as close to National Socialism as Butter is to Peanut Butter. Marxist Socialism is INTERNATIONALIST and anti-RACIST, anti-anti-Semitic, and has nothing to do with cultural heritage.

Karl Marx was a Jew and so, Hitler and his followers would have hated everything about him from the get-go. Hitler also didn't pick the name--the NSDAP was in existence and he joined it, before rising to lead it, just as Trump didn't create the Republican Party, merely joined it and took it over.

If someone comes here with a question, why is it trolling? If you or I went on another forum and asked a question is it trolling? I just joined this forum and see this over and over. I've even been subtly accused myself.

What gives around here? The majority of gun forums are Conservative. Are we not allowed there? This is ridiculous.

willjr75 wrote: Sat Oct 20, 2018 12:45 am If someone comes here with a question, why is it trolling? If you or I went on another forum and asked a question is it trolling? I just joined this forum and see this over and over. I've even been subtly accused myself.

What gives around here? The majority of gun forums are Conservative. Are we not allowed there? This is ridiculous.

Yes. You are ridiculous. You and your fellow trolls all came on here at the same time cross posting mutually supportive comments.
You guys aren’t very good at this. I spotted you right off. You will not take over this forum. You have a gazillion conservotard
forums to go hang out on. This one is ours.

I’m not subtly accusing you of being a troll. I’m outright calling you a troll to your virtual face. Prove me wrong.

Have you seen my voter registration card?

CaseHardened wrote: Fri Oct 19, 2018 11:54 pm Maybe you don't know ?

I do not either.

Would we both be wise to find out ?

Oops, your syntax is showing, comrade. In America, they have good saying that I will now teach:

"Better to be silent and be suspected of being an Russian troll, than to open one's mouth and remove all doubt."

Nostrovia!

Do you know where I stand on certain issues? If so, please enlighten me.

Could it be? The ignoble 400 lbs guy our president referred to, sitting in his bed pretending to be more than one person online? Right here in our lil'ol forum?

Mah, ghad! You're famous!

CaseHardened wrote: Fri Oct 19, 2018 11:54 pm Maybe you don't know ?

I do not either.

Would we both be wise to find out ?

Let's see. We have diplomatic cables released by WikiLeaks that show the US wanting Venezuela's oil. We have manipulated votes. We have a US/Saudi push to flood the market with oil and decimate Venezuela's main source of income (a technique used by President Reagan against the USSR). We have a problem with pro-US Colombia on their border. We have Clinton email showing that we're manipulating their government. We have Tillerson threatening 'regime change'.

Yeah, is must be the socialism.

http://cepr.net/blogs/the-americas-blog ... d-honduras
https://www.telesurtv.net/english/news/ ... -0041.html
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-vene ... SKBN1AI1KZ
https://www.telesurtv.net/english/news/ ... -0030.html
https://www.telesurtv.net/english/news/ ... -0034.html
https://www.iol.co.za/sundayindependent ... a-15898260

Popcorn in the popper.

SR

My understanding (and it's probably wrong) is corrupt government, inability to adapt to falling petroleum revenue and possibly foreign meddling.

Economies based on extractive activities, like oil and mining, tend to be more corrupt and unstable to start with. Add on inept economic policies, crass populism, despotism, authoritarianism, and many other very bad and anti-liberal things, and you got your answer.

CaseHardened wrote: Fri Oct 19, 2018 11:53 pm A one-word answer ?

No, I am certainly looking for more than that.

The NAZIS described themselves as Socialists.

They were immoral murderers, but until they attempted to conquer Europe, and we resisted, they certainly fed their people.

No, one word is not an answer.

You obviously slept through European History class in school. In the 1880's Bismarck instituted socialist programs in a political bid to co opt the democratic socialists. He instituted government run old age pensions, sounds like social security to me, workers compensation, and socialized medicine. His attempt to co op the democratic socialists failed. Even after instituting those social programs the democratic socialists continued to gain seats in the Reichstag.

Bismarck's strategy in the 1880s was to win the workers over for the conservative regime by implementing social benefits. He added accident and old-age insurance as well as a form of socialized medicine. He did not completely succeed, however. Support for the Social Democrats increased with each election.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Otto_von_Bismarck

Why does every person in kansas owe over $2k to the state treasury to pay off its debt?

Late to the party but since I used to tangentially work in the oil sphere for a bit the answer is Venezuela has always had one of the highest costs of extraction of any oil producing country. Coming out of the ground the shit is closer to tar than anything you think of as crude oil. When oil was at 100 dollars plus a barrel life was gravy and they leveraged that to the hilt for all kinds of shut. But as long as the oil dollars were pouring in there wasn’t any need to hold back.

Then fracking happened and the entire foundation for their economy crumbled. They have commitments based on 100 dollar oil and the money coming just couldn’t keep up. They they made some horrible crisis based decisions and it snow balled.

JerseyDog wrote: Sun Oct 21, 2018 12:19 pm Late to the party but since I used to tangentially work in the oil sphere for a bit the answer is Venezuela has always had one of the highest costs of extraction of any oil producing country. Coming out of the ground the shit is closer to tar than anything you think of as crude oil. When oil was at 100 dollars plus a barrel life was gravy and they leveraged that to the hilt for all kinds of shut. But as long as the oil dollars were pouring in there wasn’t any need to hold back.

Then fracking happened and the entire foundation for their economy crumbled. They have commitments based on 100 dollar oil and the money coming just couldn’t keep up. They they made some horrible crisis based decisions and it snow balled.

Agreed. As we know how and why the price crashed, though, I think we should move the 'blame' to its proper place.

So looking at the past 15 years we had suspicious opec rises starting around 9/11. Gas eventually got up to $5 a gallon. Chavez nationalized the oil after a failed US coup. Venezuela had a growing economy with freemarkets a generally common sense social policies. US media right and center left always had a clear anti-chavez agenda despite the countries stability and positive outlook. In 2008 crude "normalized" and we seen gas drop under $2 a gallon.

Obama had a clear anti-chavez administration. Chavez and Castro come down with terminal cancer nearly at the same time. Almost immediately Venezuela begins a downward spiral.

One thing we know for sure is opec is very obviously political and regularly manipulates supply to control crude prices.

Once we were not entirely dependent on Venezuela for oil, we cut off access to U.S. dollars, which interfered with Venezuela trading its oil for cash, which is needed to buy all sorts of goods because it never has been self-sufficient. This resulted in shortages from which they tried to print (money) their way out of.

The oil industry was also reliant on U.S. technology, so once the access to replacement parts and technology was cut off, production dropped as parts broke and couldn't be replaced. I would not be surprised if there was sabotage as well, considering we were able to execute cyber-attacks on Iran to disrupt their nuclear program.