The Liberal Gun Club Forum

I hope there are some welders on board that could give me some advice. I want a new welder, I'm a self taught wire feed welder and the only thing I know about smaw is what it stands for. I'm putting a 50amp circuit in my garage and I want a 220v wire feed that will do 1/4" steel gmaw in a single pass. The welder I have now is a very light duty 110 lincoln that I have pushed beyond its limits with flux core for max penetration since 1998. I like Lincolns but was wondering about Hobart and Miller. I flirted with the idea of an APH Alpha mig 250 but it can only be to good to be true, where would I send it for any servicing China? Anybody have an opinion on the 3 name brands mentioned?

eelj wrote:I hope there are some welders on board that could give me some advice. I want a new welder, I'm a self taught wire feed welder and the only thing I know about smaw is what it stands for. I'm putting a 50amp circuit in my garage and I want a 220v wire feed that will do 1/4" steel gmaw in a single pass. The welder I have now is a very light duty 110 lincoln that I have pushed beyond its limits with flux core for max penetration since 1998. I like Lincolns but was wondering about Hobart and Miller. I flirted with the idea of an APH Alpha mig 250 but it can only be to good to be true, where would I send it for any servicing China? Anybody have an opinion on the 3 name brands mentioned?

When you upgrade your circuit in the garage also have them check you electric service to your house. A friend of mine had an arc welder and hooked to 220 but he felt it wasn't working right had electrician check everything and the service to the house was not heavy enough to handle that load. He could have had a serious fire hazard also neighbors could complain when their lights dim etc.

My last mig purchase was a Linde in 1991. I expect there is plenty on this subject I don't know, but here's some general advice:

None of them are probably terrible. It is reasonable (after making sure that you aren't picking something with known problems) to make the decision based on who has the best support in your area. Which local dealer sucks? Don't buy what they sell, buy what the other guy sells.

It's just like your loyalty to Dillon.

Another tip: for general purpose work on mild steel, straight CO2 gives better penetration than the argon blends and is cheaper.

any welding info I could give would be 30-40 years old and mostly about stick welding or gas welding.
find a good welding supply store in your area, they should have several brands and maybe some used/trade in equip. is there a welding shop in the area? worst thing that could happen is that they're busy and don't have time for questions. is there any classes at a community college or continuing ed?
if your not going into business and welding 40+ hours a week, maybe shop comparable equip. at Harbor Freight or Northerntool.
good luck. have fun.

I'm more of an SMAW welder and I've done some fine detail welding with the SMAW as well. The wire feeders are very convenient though and for general welding they're very nice to have. As for Lincoln, Miller & Hobart. Miller owns Hobart, so the Hobart's are just the low cost Millers. I know a couple of guys who have some of the nicer Chinese welders and they're very happy with them. There are some Chinese welders that are very good welders, but I couldn't tell you which ones are good and which aren't. I don't know many who have complaints with Lincoln & Miller boxes; they're just bulletproof. I've been a Lincoln man my whole life but I've used Millers and they're very good.

If I had a welder I'd have a dozen unfinished welding projects laying around here.

Sorry. I still cook my steel with gas.

Simmer down wrote:If I had a welder I'd have a dozen unfinished welding projects laying around here.

That's about what happened to me when I had one. Fortunately I don't have the space anymore

My Lincoln was solid, did great. Also tried the HF which was junk. The Chinese combo was pretty handy, bit I wanted tig/plasma/arc more than the Mig on my Lincoln, so sold the Lincoln. Dad always used a Miller.

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Hey, I think I can actually weigh in on this. I'm a hobbyist welder (if my Internet weren't so shitty right now I'd post a photo of my shop) but I kind of stretch the definition of "hobby." I have six welders, from TIG to MIG to SMAW (and my Oxyfuel rig). In fact, I own my own fabrication company.

Right now the hot ticket is the Lincoln 210MP. This is a multiprocess rig that is convertible between 240-120V, so you can use it pretty much anywhere. It does GMAW (I've done 1/4" single-pass before with one), DC SMAW, and DC GTAW. While I don't own one (yet), the one I've used was quite nice and I tend to like Lincoln's MIG welders pretty well.

I do have some AHP boxes. My AC/DC GTAW is an AlphaTIG 200x, and it's pretty great. I've had no complaints with it so far, and have used it on mild steel (20ga-1/4"), stainless, and aluminum. I also have an AlphaCUT 60 plasma cutter, which is freaking awesome. Disclosure, though: My first AlphaCUT had an infant failure and had to go back. However, while the company imports from China (AHP is run by the brother of the guy who runs Everlast, actually) their offices are out of the Bay area in California. Their tech support is good, and the news of the failure was so shocking to them (apparently) that the President of the company called me personally to apologize and make things right. Of course, I did purchase the second AlphaCUT sold in the US, so there is that, too. They did have great service and turnaround and shipped me a new rig before I could sneeze, and then just had me ship my old one back at my convenience.

If you want to go with something heavier, Miller makes some really great 240V welders. My Millermatic 251 is older and heavy but jesus is it ever rock-solid. Right now I'm running .035" GMAW in it but I've also run a lot of .045" FCAW-G, which is power-hungry and that Miller doesn't even blink (though I did have to buy a Bernard Q gun to handle the heat from FCAW-G).

Ultimately, if you have the scratch I'd strongly suggest the Lincoln 210MP. It's portable, handy, and a good machine. Plus, if you decide you want to get into steel TIG you can buy the gun and a canister of 100% argon and go to town (note, though, that as it's DC-only you will not be able to TIG aluminum -- though you could spool-gun MIG aluminum with 100% Ar if you really wanted).

Good advice from Brandon and all. Probably don't have to worry about dimming your neighbors' lights if you have a modern panel on your house.

Also self taught and started with MIG. When I was more into motorcycling, I used a pretty big Millermatic 300 wire-welder shielded with CO2. It would penetrate way more than I ever needed for creating custom motorcycle luggage racks, exhaust systems, and repairing bike trailers. Since that time I've always associated old Miller's as very high quality welders. Have since tried learning a bit of TIG welding for fine work on firearm parts on a friend's modern Lincoln rig. TIG is fun but can be a frustrating learning curve.

BTW, what projects are you mostly welding these days?

Just checked in on this thread and thanks for the responses. I agree with Brandon on the Lincoln 210, I could buy that at an Airgas branch in Duluth that is a service center. Everything else is either internet or big box store. The APH Alpha Mig is very enticing but all of the reviews say the same thing, it needs a different mig gun so it really isn't any cheaper than the Lincoln. Also I would like to play around with a stick welder but I'm not going to buy a dedicated stick welder to do it so the 210 gets the nod there. It all comes down to money and if I'm going to buy via the internet or from a big box store it will be a Hobart or lincoln or miller. The Hobart has a model that is heavy duty enough for very thick steel using fcaw and the implements I want to make for my tractor can have splatter on them they just have to have the strength to withstand leverage on the welds. I want to build a boom and a skidder for my 3 point hitch on my tractor.
I've got time to think about this, I do appreciate the input.

Bisbee wrote:Good advice from Brandon and all. Probably don't have to worry about dimming your neighbors' lights if you have a modern panel on your house.

Also self taught and started with MIG. When I was more into motorcycling, I used a pretty big Millermatic 300 wire-welder shielded with CO2. It would penetrate way more than I ever needed for creating custom motorcycle luggage racks, exhaust systems, and repairing bike trailers. Since that time I've always associated old Miller's as very high quality welders. Have since tried learning a bit of TIG welding for fine work on firearm parts on a friend's modern Lincoln rig. TIG is fun but can be a frustrating learning curve.

BTW, what projects are you mostly welding these days?

Motorcycles are the whole reason that I got into welding. I built a shop in my garage at my old house devoted to working on them and making attachments for them. When I was done I barely had enough room for my bikes in a double garage.
I designed and built a trailer hitch for my Guzzi to haul a trailer I built that weighed close to 500lbs when loaded, a luggage rack with quick attach mounts for pop off soft saddlebags. I built a lift table from some plans I bought that is big enough and rated to hold a Boss Hoss, a bead breaker that I can mount on my welding table that has a 6ft long heavy steel pipe for popping the beads and changing my own tires.
This new tractor I bought has had the same effect on me, oh the shit I want to fabricate for that. My wife just tells herself when I get like this that at least he's not sitting in the bar picking up floozies.

For reference, here are most of my welders:



And here's my garage, but before I added the massive vertical bandsaw or a bunch of other tools:



I'm working on building a bigger shop out back.

Looks like a nice playroom Mr Smash, how old is that Lincoln tombstone?

Good thread! I have cheap Lincoln 135T that I used a lot for my job a few years ago. I went to use it recently and it seems to not be working. I had the mother board replaced once already and that cost nearly as much as I paid used for the welder. The company I work for has promised me a new one at the end of the year to go with my new workshop which I just had 220v installed in.

I think there is a Lincoln 210Mp in my near future.

Thanks!

eelj wrote:Looks like a nice playroom Mr Smash, how old is that Lincoln tombstone?

Good eye!

That old tombstone is circa mid-1970s.

Mason wrote:Good thread! I have cheap Lincoln 135T that I used a lot for my job a few years ago. I went to use it recently and it seems to not be working. I had the mother board replaced once already and that cost nearly as much as I paid used for the welder. The company I work for has promised me a new one at the end of the year to go with my new workshop which I just had 220v installed in.

I think there is a Lincoln 210Mp in my near future.

Thanks!

Hobart makes a 210 wire feed that costs less then 900 bucks, plus it can be used either 110 or 220. When I go to my you tube account they fill the pages up with welding and metal fabricating videos as suggested for me. Watching a lot of them it is quite appalling how many of these guys are welding and gas cutting not only in Tshirts but bare handed.

eelj wrote:

Mason wrote:Good thread! I have cheap Lincoln 135T that I used a lot for my job a few years ago. I went to use it recently and it seems to not be working. I had the mother board replaced once already and that cost nearly as much as I paid used for the welder. The company I work for has promised me a new one at the end of the year to go with my new workshop which I just had 220v installed in.

I think there is a Lincoln 210Mp in my near future.

Thanks!

Hobart makes a 210 wire feed that costs less then 900 bucks, plus it can be used either 110 or 220. When I go to my you tube account they fill the pages up with welding and metal fabricating videos as suggested for me. Watching a lot of them it is quite appalling how many of these guys are welding and gas cutting not only in Tshirts but bare handed.

I will admit to setting my sleeve on fire because I forgot to put my gauntlets on. I had been using the angle grinder wearing leather mechanics gloves and just picked up the gun and started welding.

Polyester/cotton sweatshirts are a no-no. I have a welding jacket now - with flame DECALS on the sleeves!

I had some shopping to do today in Duluth. I was in a big fleet farm store to pick up some ground tarps and walked by their welding display.
They sell Hobarts and I checked out the 210 and the 190 mig welders and am very impressed.
When I left there I went to Airgas as I was leaving town and they are a welding store and sell both Miller and Lincoln. I was really impressed with what I saw in the Lincoln 210 MVP. The hobart 210 with a big wheel of wire will weigh just shy of 100lbs While the inverter welders that Miller and Lincoln make are so light they feel like toys.
Mason I know up thread you expressed a desire for the Lincoln and right now they are on sale for 1199, after the sale they will be 1400 bucks. My self I'm on a fixed income and have a bunch of other financial obligations so if I buy a welder it will be the Hobart and a new auto darkening hood. Since Ms Asian Pivot will be sworn in next Jan I figure buying Chinese like the AHP might not be very wise.

what is a Klutch?
I get ads in the margins when I visit some pages. just now I see this one and click on it---
http://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/ ... gQod5QwPaQ

gungun wrote:what is a Klutch?
I get ads in the margins when I visit some pages. just now I see this one and click on it---
http://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/ ... gQod5QwPaQ

If you are seriously considering buying a welder with what little I know I would not recommend a klutch.

Stick arc rules around here for most projects. That would be an ancient Lincoln 225.

There is a flux-wire job somewhere around here, but I don't use it very often,

Oxy-acet get a fair amount of use as well, but not enuf to pop for a plasma machine.

Subs

Wish I had seen this thread months ago!
Great to know that Mr. Smash, eelj, and Bisbee are not only expert welders, they are motorcycle guys as well!

I have two cheapo H-F welders and they do just fine for the minimal amount of hidden (ie ugly) welding I do. One is their 120v wire-feed that was about $84 bucks on one of their once-in-a-while super-low priced sale. I was able to reinforce the rusting, weakened super-structure on my pool with it. As the amp draw is pretty high I ran it off my generator. I bought a bunch of various flat mild steel first just to practice on to see if I could make solid welds that wouldn't break under abuse. Replaced the crappy HF wire with the better stuff.

Then, I waited and waited and waited until they had a little inverter stick welder reduced. They NEVER put those on sale, but they had open box one for about $95 bucks so I grabbed it. Hadn't even TRIED stick welding since I was in the 7th grade--in 1967 (!) so it took a bit to get it working, but it did fine, again reinforcing something hidden. Damn thing's the size of a toaster! (2 slice, not 4! )

But since I don't have much need for welding and the 2 H-F's actually WORK, I simply cannot justify spending a ton of money on a Miller or a Lincoln.

This is my 2002 Yamaha FZ1:
and my 2004 FJR:

Almost forgot about this thread, I'm no expert, just a DIY type of person.

I ended up buying a Hobart 210 MVP. Bought a 20lb co2 bottle and did a lot of fabricating this past year. I'm glad that I went with a transformer machine, the inverters may be great but are as throw away as iphones and computers, plus the capacitors like to be used everyday or they wear out quicker. Transformers just keep working.

It's a strange addiction, where ever I go I tend to look at the welds on steel and aluminium structures, I tend to fantasize about all of the equipment for fabricating I feel that I need.

I think people should avoid this addiction and get involved in something less destructive, like sex, gambling, alcohol or narcotics addiction.