The Liberal Gun Club Forum

senorgrand wrote:pics?

Here you go, apologies for the cell phone quality pics and boring workbench top background:

Nice!

"Your desire to shoot guns for fun and collect however many you want is not more important than other people's lives, sorry." from one of my friends who countered my argument about defending the sport of targeting shooting. I feel your pain man. Really sucks getting painted with the same brush again. Strangely enough getting painted with the same brush in any kind of hobby (fishing, hunting, playing video games, etc.) where something really bad happens you do get plastered as a bad person because of a very few bad apples in the overall group. It is great to have a community like this to calm your nerves.

Yeah. I am going to fly drones and play with my kids. Today was exhausting online and off.

beaurrr wrote:For what it's worth; I just got home after spending three weeks with my family, one of whom is a serious devotee of Faux News. Fuck; watching Bill o'Reilly followed by Megan whats-her-face is enough to make any liberal's head explode. That shit's like crack for white geezers (I would imagine). More than one evening, I had to just get the fuck out of there and go drive around.

I restrict my visits to my dad's home, because my stepmother does nothing but watch that crap all day long. It's enough to make me cut their cable line.

I got to the same point yesterday. Got off FB and the news and sat down with a few good beers and a night of Netflix binge watching.
Tomorrow I head to Decatur Ga to my favorite pub in the world to visit good friends.

Monday I head to Anniston AL to attend the CMP Advanced Maintenance Class. Tuesday is my birthday. I'm turning 50. I will be officially old. Anyway stay tuned for pics.

Yeah, rest your weary bones, stones.

senorgrand: frame the story as a civil rights story/LTE instead of a pro gun one.

CDFingers

We should all do this.

https://youtu.be/LS-ErOKpO4E

I'm sorry to disturb your rest, but here is a correction:

bigstones wrote:I am tired. I am tired of explaining to people that in California there are:
mandatory extensive background checks more stringent than the federal ones,
an assault weapon ban,
magazine capacity limits,
...

There are rumors around that (specifically addressing these three points):

The two San Bernadino shooters didn't actually buy the weapons themselves, but obtained them through straw purchases (had others buy the guns for them). If true, they did not go through background checks. Which is weird, because there is no reason to believe that they would have been unable to pass these checks and buy guns.

Assault weapons like AR15 and AK47 in California need bullet buttons, which make them into fixed-magazine rifles (I don't understand the details), and the shooters did not have bullet buttons, otherwise they wouldn't have been able to fire this many rounds so fast, as you can't reload such a rifle. As far as I can see, they are just temporarily bolted over the magazine release, and can be trivially unscrewed.

The shooters had 30-round magazines for their rifles, which are de-facto illegal in California: Given their age, the shooters could not have used grandfathered old stock magazines, they have not been legally for sale since 2000.

If those rumors are true, it actually demonstrates that it is nearly pointless for one locality (even a very large state like California) to pass gun control laws that can be easily circumvented by driving around a little bit, or having a friend doing the driving for you, or unscrewing something. To be effective, gun control laws must not control the gun (not be hardware-specific), but the gun owner (the software).

If anyone knows of a good cave, I am thinking of a new career as a hermit.

Indeed, these are good times to hide from the news to maintain one's sanity. I'm so glad that by the grace of God I'm not a muslim. Not because there is anything wrong with being a muslim, rather on the contrary. But because for the foreseeable future they'll have targets painted on them here in the USA. Muslims need to not only hide in caves, but also make sure their caves have bulletproof windows.

SoftwareEngineer wrote: Muslims need to not only hide in caves, but also make sure their caves have bulletproof windows.

Indeed.

Immediately after the bombing of Pearl Harbor, President Roosevelt issued Presidential Proclamations 2525, 2526, and 2527 to authorize the United States to detain allegedly potentially dangerous enemy aliens. The FBI and other law enforcement agencies arrested thousands of suspected enemy aliens, mostly individuals of German, Italian, or Japanese ancestry, living throughout the United States.

link:

http://www.archives.gov/research/immigr ... rview.html

CDFingers

SoftwareEngineer wrote:
The two San Bernadino shooters didn't actually buy the weapons themselves, but obtained them through straw purchases (had others buy the guns for them). If true, they did not go through background checks. Which is weird, because there is no reason to believe that they would have been unable to pass these checks and buy guns.

Even if true, the point is that California has mandatory UBC's for all transactions. FFL or private party must, by law, go through a UBC. So it's not even just a straw purchase (which is illegal), it was also a transfer without going through an FFL which is also already illegal. So his original point is indeed accurate.

Assault weapons like AR15 and AK47 in California need bullet buttons, which make them into fixed-magazine rifles (I don't understand the details), and the shooters did not have bullet buttons, otherwise they wouldn't have been able to fire this many rounds so fast, as you can't reload such a rifle. As far as I can see, they are just temporarily bolted over the magazine release, and can be trivially unscrewed.

'Stones and I both live in CA, and are very familiar with the bullet buttons. It's not nearly as difficult as you describe to perform a magazine change, there are kits you can install onto your magazine to use as the tool to drop the mag, or you can get a bullet button "ring" to wear. Either way you can certainly reload the rifle.

That said, they are quite easy to remove, as it's just a part, and it can be replaced very simply. Additionally there are convertible bullet buttons that can be used with a 22lr upper in normal config, and bullet button enabled in centerfire config.

But Bigstones is 100% right. By the definition of the CA state legislature, "assault weapons" have indeed been banned for a very long time in CA, dating back to the 1990's. An AR or AK with a bullet button is not an "assault weapon" as defined by the state.

So the point about the AWB are indeed accurate, and if the perps removed or modified the rifles, that was the illegal manufacturing of an "assault weapon" under California law.

The shooters had 30-round magazines for their rifles, which are de-facto illegal in California: Given their age, the shooters could not have used grandfathered old stock magazines, they have not been legally for sale since 2000.

Likely true. It would be a simple trip to Nevada and you could buy as many 30 or 100 rounders as you want. Which are illegal to import.

So the laws are there in CA, but they did not have any impact on the shooters, as they clearly broke many CA laws in addition to the terrorism that they inflicted.

Pretty sure France outlawed the guns and magazines used by those terrorists too. Small consolation to the victims.

MayhemVI wrote:http://rapidcityjournal.com/news/local/ ... 76748.html

Bud and Charlene Bartholow of Rapid City often travel with their adult sons, Foster and Matt, when the two master trapshooters compete at events across the country, including the annual world trapshooting championship in Illinois.

It's probably a good thing they travel as a family, because the Bartholow brothers often bring home so many trophies, they need other people to help carry them all.

Well, this article came up on my radar just in time for me to help cheer you up. I hope it helps.

Hm, I was born in Rapid, although I've lived in Wyoming 90+% of my life. I have kind of a soft spot for Rapid. I needed this. Thank you.

CDFingers wrote:Yeah, rest your weary bones, stones.

senorgrand: frame the story as a civil rights story/LTE instead of a pro gun one.

CDFingers

They seem to be uninterested in anything that isn't anti-gun at the moment. I had a long conversation with the editorial editor...unlikely to get anywhere at this time.

senorgrand wrote:

CDFingers wrote:Yeah, rest your weary bones, stones.

senorgrand: frame the story as a civil rights story/LTE instead of a pro gun one.

CDFingers

They seem to be uninterested in anything that isn't anti-gun at the moment. I had a long conversation with the editorial editor...unlikely to get anywhere at this time.

It's unfortunate that they're taking that stance, but I can understand. If they run a pro-gun op-ed right now they will lose subscriptions, they will get calls and they will hear about it from higher ups. From a financial standpoint they're making the right move, from an editorial, journalistic and ethical standpoint it's foolish.

Ha! This is funny. Go over to the Intro forum and read my intro message "Hello from DC". I might have written this message.

Well first I joined ARfascists, knowing that it was going to be a tough road. I just ignored the more nutty stuff and tried to participate where I saw someplace open for dialog. One thing they continually said to me was that I should join DU, one of the sites I've never heard of before. So I did.

I am a Progressive but I really cannot abide liars or duplicity. They have a little cretin there at DU that baits conversations by posting the most outrageous articles I've seen in awhile that basically suggested all 2A supporters were anti-Semites and held up this one White Supremacist as proof.

I called him on it and what this guy does is that whenever someone posts a message remotely supporting 2A rights, he reports the message as abusive. That automatically puts your posting to a "vote" of 12 other random members and if they agree, you are automatically banned. The process begs for the creation of echo chambers with no opposing points of view from the strict liberal party line. That's even more dangerous to my way of thinking and smacks of groupthink. So I was banned after like 10 postings on the board. I reported the jerk and what he was doing to the admins but never receive a reply.

Back to ARfacists. Overall many of the members were willing to talk about things. I let it be known that I was gay and have been married for 19 years. There were more than the usual number of religious people that couldn't deal which was fine. A significant number of religious that while not outright affirming were at least not ready to burn me at the stake. And the majority (mostly younger) were like hey, whatever "trips your trigger" is fine by me. They did have one self hating gay guy that worried me and struck me as unbalanced enough that I might be reading about him in the news someday.

Then I posted a message describing a TXT exchange I had with my partner. We've lived in DC a long time and never had an opportunity to own guns until recently. I was in the military and owned a rifle and pistol which I had to sell when I moved into DC in the 80's. My partner has never shot a gun.

So while I am down here in Texas for school, I decided to pick up a pistol or two since we can now own again in DC. My partner is coming down here for Christmas so I asked him if he wanted to go to a range for some target shooting. Here was the thread:

http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_1_5/181256 ... tml&page=1

An admin named Aimless banned me for that message claiming I was talking about gay sex (I was correcting the normal who's the man and who's the wife crap) and was a troll user. The Admins there also will not even talk to me about the ban.

So welcome to the land of Misfit Toys!

Land of misfit toys indeed! I think you've found a home here...several gay AR-owners around here.

Merkwuerdigliebe wrote:Ha! This is funny. Go over to the Intro forum and read my intro message "Hello from DC". I might have written this message.

Well first I joined ARfascists, knowing that it was going to be a tough road. I just ignored the more nutty stuff and tried to participate where I saw someplace open for dialog. One thing they continually said to me was that I should join DU, one of the sites I've never heard of before. So I did.

I am a Progressive but I really cannot abide liars or duplicity. They have a little cretin there at DU that baits conversations by posting the most outrageous articles I've seen in awhile that basically suggested all 2A supporters were anti-Semites and held up this one White Supremacist as proof.

I called him on it and what this guy does is that whenever someone posts a message remotely supporting 2A rights, he reports the message as abusive. That automatically puts your posting to a "vote" of 12 other random members and if they agree, you are automatically banned. The process begs for the creation of echo chambers with no opposing points of view from the strict liberal party line. That's even more dangerous to my way of thinking and smacks of groupthink. So I was banned after like 10 postings on the board. I reported the jerk and what he was doing to the admins but never receive a reply.

Back to ARfacists. Overall many of the members were willing to talk about things. I let it be known that I was gay and have been married for 19 years. There were more than the usual number of religious people that couldn't deal which was fine. A significant number of religious that while not outright affirming were at least not ready to burn me at the stake. And the majority (mostly younger) were like hey, whatever "trips your trigger" is fine by me. They did have one self hating gay guy that worried me and struck me as unbalanced enough that I might be reading about him in the news someday.

Then I posted a message describing a TXT exchange I had with my partner. We've lived in DC a long time and never had an opportunity to own guns until recently. I was in the military and owned a rifle and pistol which I had to sell when I moved into DC in the 80's. My partner has never shot a gun.

So while I am down here in Texas for school, I decided to pick up a pistol or two since we can now own again in DC. My partner is coming down here for Christmas so I asked him if he wanted to go to a range for some target shooting. Here was the thread:

http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_1_5/181256 ... tml&page=1

An admin named Aimless banned me for that message claiming I was talking about gay sex (I was correcting the normal who's the man and who's the wife crap) and was a troll user. The Admins there also will not even talk to me about the ban.

So welcome to the land of Misfit Toys!

I think you will find here you will just be a human being. No one cares about your love life.


Your love life is your problem

I am just mystified by some of these sites and when I look at something like ARfacists my alarm bells go off. It wouldn't surprise me at all if the entire site wasn't FB* flypaper. The things people say on these sites and the cheerleading squad they have on it -- what a wonderful honey pot for extremist! If not outright run by the FB* (which would circumvent all sorts of privacy issues when you are the site owner), you know that they are scraping that site like crazy.

I don't view the Government as the Evil Empire, but they aren't stupid either. If you want to identify home grown groups and individuals mentally and logistically capable of perpetrating domestic terrorism, where are you going to go? Someplace where outright sedition is openly preached, or the gardening forum? If you want to understand the model, read about Government efforts against C#ild P*rn which they are a lot more willing to talk about.

Food for thought....

culannmac wrote:We should all do this.

https://youtu.be/LS-ErOKpO4E

That might be the greatest video in the history of YouTube.