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Just two more reasons why the DEA and Drug War needs to stop

Posted: Sat Nov 28, 2015 4:29 pm
by TrueTexan
Here's two more reasons the drug war and DEA are worthless
Drivers in Maryland's Harford County were subjected to a pre-Thanksgiving series of rolling traffic checkpoints aimed at cracking down on heroin. The checkpoints were of dubious legality, but that didn't stop Sheriff Jeffrey Gahler from interfering with motorists' freedom to travel down the road Tuesday in a law enforcement operation that netted primarily small amounts of cash and drugs…and a switchblade knife.
http://www.alternet.org/drugs/maryland- ... heckpoints

May not be legal and sheriff along with DEA doesn't understand court rulings or "Bill of Rights".

On to the better case.
You don’t see many drug traffickers retire,” gloated Bill Furay, head of the DEA’s office in Beaumont, Texas, following the arrest of a wealthy couple from a tiny neighborhood in Pearland. “Either they end up in prison, or they end up dead.”

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Furay apparently never had time to give that lecture to his teenage daughter, Sarah, who was arrested earlier this month on drug-trafficking charges that could result in decades behind bars.

For years, Furay has styled himself the implacable scourge of drug dealers, becoming a familiar presence at triumphant DEA press conferences announcing mass arrests and seizures of contraband and proceeds.
Taking out a drug syndicate is an exercise in futility akin to bailing out the Pacific Ocean with a thimble. When the DEA “decimated” one narcotics syndicate, all it did was create an opportunity for another one to fill it. While Furay was busy with sting operations, controlled buys and press conferences, he apparently neglected to supervise his daughter Sarah, who was arrested at her College Station home on November 8 and faces a variety of narcotics-related charges.

A probable cause statement quoted by NBC affiliate KCEN claims that police found “31.5 grams of packaged cocaine, 126 grams of high grade marijuana, 29 'ecstasy' tablets, methamphetamine and 60 doses of a drug similar to LSD” in Sarah Furay’s bedroom. They also reported finding two digital scales, packaging materials and a handwritten drug price list. Police found text messages in her phone discussing drug transactions.

Sarah Furay faces at least three felony charges that would ordinarily result in long prison time: The aggregate maximum sentence would be 215 years behind bars and a $30,000 fine. That terrifying prospect notwithstanding, Miss Furay can be seen smiling broadly in her booking photo, which has been called the “happiest mugshot in America.” After spending a day in jail, the 19-year-old, referred to in press accounts as an “adorable drug kingpin,” posted $39,000 bond and was released. On November 23, the online magazine Death and Taxes reported that Sarah is the daughter of DEA official Bill Furay and Shawn Creswell, principal of the Coulson Tough Elementary School in Woodlands.
http://www.alternet.org/civil-liberties ... ead-honcho

Now how much property and cash has the law enforcement seized in this case? They need to do a through investigation where she gets her drugs.

Re: Just two more reasons why the DEA and Drug War needs to

Posted: Sun Nov 29, 2015 8:34 am
by CDFingers
The Drug War and the DEA are worth a lot--to private prison companies.

This is the opening graph for the ACLU's Mass Incarceration/Private Prisons page:
Today, for-profit companies are responsible for approximately 6 percent of state prisoners, 16 percent of federal prisoners, and inmates in local jails in Texas, Louisiana, and a handful of other states. While supporters of private prisons tout the idea that governments can save money through privatization, the evidence is mixed at best—in fact, private prisons may in some instances cost more than governmental ones. These private prisons have also been linked to numerous cases of violence and atrocious conditions.
link:

https://www.aclu.org/issues/mass-incarc ... te-prisons

Getting folks into the prison system is a lucrative business.
Several industries have become notorious for the millions they spend on influencing legislation and getting friendly candidates into office: Big Oil, Big Pharma and the gun lobby among them. But one has managed to quickly build influence with comparatively little scrutiny: Private prisons. The two largest for-profit prison companies in the United States – GEO and Corrections Corporation of America – and their associates have funneled more than $10 million to candidates since 1989 and have spent nearly $25 million on lobbying efforts. Meanwhile, these private companies have seen their revenue and market share soar. They now rake in a combined $3.3 billion in annual revenue and the private federal prison population more than doubled between 2000 and 2010, according to a report by the Justice Policy Institute. Private companies house nearly half of the nation’s immigrant detainees, compared to about 25 percent a decade ago, a Huffington Post report found. In total, there are now about 130 private prisons in the country with about 157,000 beds.
link:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/postever ... ing-about/

It's interesting when we look at which states have fallen for the big money of privatized prisons:

Image


Ending the Drug War will be costly for a lot of folks. We're seeing changes in states that have legalized marijuana in some way. In those states, the gendarmes have to come up with creative ways to imprison folks, I suppose.

CDFingers

Re: Just two more reasons why the DEA and Drug War needs to

Posted: Sun Nov 29, 2015 2:50 pm
by senorgrand
The War on Drugs is immoral, racist, illogical, costly and needs to end.

Re: Just two more reasons why the DEA and Drug War needs to

Posted: Sun Nov 29, 2015 4:13 pm
by workinstiff
Criminal Justice System? Fuck no. You are an income unit.

Re: Just two more reasons why the DEA and Drug War needs to

Posted: Tue Dec 01, 2015 7:56 pm
by wjthompson
Actually the for profit prison system in some states are working on low cost expansion investment opportunities when they to stop abortions and protect the unborn tried to include crimalizin miscarriages unless a Doctor could attest the mother had not had done anything to cause it. The prison industry was looking forward to an influx of new mostly poor inmates. Women are cheaper to house than men. Fortunately the outcry was quick and it died. The current drug war is just as stupid. I graduated HS in 1970, new nothing of drugs and got my 1st lecture in assembly from a cop that apparently didn't know any more than me. He told us one hit of heroin and your hooked for life. Pure bulshit. A buddy back from Nam I asked how the hell did you get strung out on heroin. It was in the the pot he was smoking every day and didn't know it until it was too late.


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Re: Just two more reasons why the DEA and Drug War needs to

Posted: Tue Dec 01, 2015 7:56 pm
by wjthompson
Actually the for profit prison system in some states are working on low cost expansion investment opportunities when they to stop abortions and protect the unborn tried to include crimalizin miscarriages unless a Doctor could attest the mother had not had done anything to cause it. The prison industry was looking forward to an influx of new mostly poor inmates. Women are cheaper to house than men. Fortunately the outcry was quick and it died. The current drug war is just as stupid. I graduated HS in 1970, new nothing of drugs and got my 1st lecture in assembly from a cop that apparently didn't know any more than me. He told us one hit of heroin and your hooked for life. Pure bulshit. A buddy back from Nam I asked how the hell did you get strung out on heroin. It was in the the pot he was smoking every day and didn't know it until it was too late.


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Re: Just two more reasons why the DEA and Drug War needs to

Posted: Tue Dec 01, 2015 8:00 pm
by wjthompson
Don't know how it posted that again like a hiccup.


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Re: Just two more reasons why the DEA and Drug War needs to

Posted: Fri Dec 04, 2015 9:08 pm
by wjthompson
Don't know how the above posts screwed up so bad there is a sentence dropped. Anyway it was Mississippi that contemplated jailing women for miscarriages. I think it was 3 or 4 years ago.



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Re: Just two more reasons why the DEA and Drug War needs to

Posted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 8:45 am
by tc556guy
I don't care to live in a nation where things like heroin and cocaine are legal and can be bought over the counter.

Re: Just two more reasons why the DEA and Drug War needs to

Posted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 10:45 am
by RurouniKakita
tc556guy wrote:I don't care to live in a nation where things like heroin and cocaine are legal and can be bought over the counter.
I don't think anyone is calling for it to be available over the counter. Using the drugs shouldn't result in criminal charges that land what are essentially victims in prison. Instead they should be required to enter a rehabilitation program, which would probably end up being run by the same people as the prisons but ideally the only ones there would be other users, so we get less of the criminal academy that many prisons have become. Now if one is caught selling the drugs charges are absolutely required and should be prosecuted under the full extent of the law and put into regular PMITA prison.

Re: Just two more reasons why the DEA and Drug War needs to

Posted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 11:08 am
by shinzen
This is one of those subjects where there is a wide degree of difference in this herd of cats. My semi-unpopular position is actually full legalization, with treatment and support for addicts.

Why?

If we look at the deaths/crime that revolves around the drug trade, the largest reason for violence is motivated by money with the drug cartels. If it was instead legalized and regulated, so as to eliminate the profit motive, then we'd see a corresponding massive drop in rates of violence and crime. We could then spend our police resources combating actual crime instead of pursuing petty users and narco traffickers.

We've spent a trillion dollars so far on the war on drugs, and have not seen any decline in the availability or use. It's time to think differently about the problem.

http://www.cnn.com/2012/12/06/opinion/b ... -on-drugs/

Re: Just two more reasons why the DEA and Drug War needs to

Posted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 11:20 am
by modernhamlet
shinzen wrote:This is one of those subjects where there is a wide degree of difference in this herd of cats. My semi-unpopular position is actually full legalization, with treatment and support for addicts.
This.

If we legalized all drugs and poured even 1/10th of the money that we funnel into the War on Drugs instead into treatment and rehabilitation, the social ills of drug use would be relatively minor. And vanishingly small relative to the insane negative externalities caused by the War on Drugs.

Re: Just two more reasons why the DEA and Drug War needs to

Posted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 11:24 am
by tc556guy
RurouniKakita wrote:
tc556guy wrote:I don't care to live in a nation where things like heroin and cocaine are legal and can be bought over the counter.
I don't think anyone is calling for it to be available over the counter. Using the drugs shouldn't result in criminal charges that land what are essentially victims in prison. Instead they should be required to enter a rehabilitation program, which would probably end up being run by the same people as the prisons but ideally the only ones there would be other users, so we get less of the criminal academy that many prisons have become. Now if one is caught selling the drugs charges are absolutely required and should be prosecuted under the full extent of the law and put into regular PMITA prison.
If you decriminalize it, then you legalize it and it is commercially available without criminal repercussions
Once again, I don't care to live in such a society.
Do addicts need treatment? Sure. But in my experience most wont get it, and when its court ordered they blow off multiple rehab programs at great cost to the taxpayers and without any repercussions to themselves

Re: Just two more reasons why the DEA and Drug War needs to

Posted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 11:54 am
by shinzen
tc556guy wrote: Once again, I don't care to live in such a society.
Why?

Re: Just two more reasons why the DEA and Drug War needs to

Posted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 12:20 pm
by TrueTexan
I really believe we should follow the Portugal model. Legalize all drugs and give treatment for addiction. Since they legalized all drugs the HIV rate, addiction rates and the overdose rates have dropped and the crime rate has not increased.

http://www.tdpf.org.uk/blog/drug-decrim ... d-straight

Re: Just two more reasons why the DEA and Drug War needs to

Posted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 12:27 pm
by CDFingers
I'm with True Texan and shinzen on this: legalize and treat addiction. It's cheaper, is the best reason. Plus, people get to exercise liberty.

CDFingers

Re: Just two more reasons why the DEA and Drug War needs to

Posted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 12:42 pm
by Bacchus
I'm in agreement with legalization. It doesn't mean unregulated, and it doesn't mean people ought to be heroin addicts. For me, it comes down to the fact that criminalization isn't working in a whole lot of ways - it's expensive and it doesn't work and it fosters, rather than reduces, criminal enterprises.

Re: Just two more reasons why the DEA and Drug War needs to

Posted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 1:01 pm
by MayhemVI
tc556guy wrote: Do addicts need treatment? Sure. But in my experience most wont get it, and when its court ordered they blow off multiple rehab programs at great cost to the taxpayers and without any repercussions to themselves

OK, since you bring it up, what exactly is your experience with addicts and addiction? How many and for how long?

Re: Just two more reasons why the DEA and Drug War needs to

Posted: Wed Dec 09, 2015 3:56 am
by Merkwuerdigliebe
Someone mentioned Portugal which I'm not specifically familiar with, but look at how the Swiss handle it. Probably a similar approach.

Re: Just two more reasons why the DEA and Drug War needs to

Posted: Wed Dec 09, 2015 6:23 am
by Coach
CDFingers wrote:I'm with True Texan and shinzen on this: legalize and treat addiction. It's cheaper, is the best reason. Plus, people get to exercise liberty.

CDFingers
Or, better yet, legalize all drugs and let the junkies put on their big boy pants and seek treatment in the private sector, if they want it.

Re: Just two more reasons why the DEA and Drug War needs to

Posted: Wed Dec 09, 2015 8:09 am
by CDFingers
I'm not in favor of hanging anyone out to dry. I would prefer the social fabric provide the treatment option. This allows persons to choose rather than having the heartless libertarian mindset choose for them.

CDFingers

Re: Just two more reasons why the DEA and Drug War needs to

Posted: Wed Dec 09, 2015 10:09 am
by Merkwuerdigliebe
I believe one aspect of this that anti-drug types loose sight of is that the quickest way to reduce the availability of drugs is to remove the profits from the drug enterprise. A unique aspect of something like opiates is that you can be a highly functioning opiate addict. Much more so than an alcoholic. The main damage caused by street version of opiates is variable strength encourages overdose and the stuff it is cut with can range from cornstarch to rat poison -- none of which is suitable for injection.

Yes, removing all criminality from drug usage will probably cause a spike in addictions. But once the profit is removed, sources will dry up and long term addiction levels will drop at least for casual users that inadvertently get hooked. Another group exhibit plain and simple addictive physiological tendencies and it would be better to maintain these people on a program of risk reduction. Many of these people are self medicating for psychological conditions (opiates have been shown to be powerful antidepressants who would benefit from frequent contact with medical professionals.

Re: Just two more reasons why the DEA and Drug War needs to

Posted: Wed Dec 09, 2015 9:01 pm
by Coach
CDFingers wrote:I'm not in favor of hanging anyone out to dry. I would prefer the social fabric provide the treatment option. This allows persons to choose rather than having the heartless libertarian mindset choose for them.

CDFingers
We're not heartless. We would gladly donate to charities that would rehabilitate addicts. Choosing to seek treatment funded by extorted tax dollars is theft.

Re: Just two more reasons why the DEA and Drug War needs to

Posted: Wed Dec 09, 2015 10:01 pm
by Merkwuerdigliebe
Coach wrote:
CDFingers wrote:I'm not in favor of hanging anyone out to dry. I would prefer the social fabric provide the treatment option. This allows persons to choose rather than having the heartless libertarian mindset choose for them.

CDFingers
We're not heartless. We would gladly donate to charities that would rehabilitate addicts. Choosing to seek treatment funded by extorted tax dollars is theft.
Psychological extortion or physical extortion, not much difference. Physical tends to be fairer though because there are a lot of heartless people out there.

Re: Just two more reasons why the DEA and Drug War needs to

Posted: Thu Dec 10, 2015 7:43 am
by FiremanBob
Coach wrote:
CDFingers wrote:I'm not in favor of hanging anyone out to dry. I would prefer the social fabric provide the treatment option. This allows persons to choose rather than having the heartless libertarian mindset choose for them.

CDFingers
We're not heartless. We would gladly donate to charities that would rehabilitate addicts. Choosing to seek treatment funded by extorted tax dollars is theft.
Coach is exactly right. It is a fallacy to equate "the social fabric" with "government". The real social fabric is made up of private individuals and organizations, not government. It is also wrong to call libertarians "heartless" - not only wrong, but insulting. The idea that a unionized government bureaucrat cares more about the well-being of his "client" than someone working in a private, mission-focused charity is ludicrous.

So to correct CDFingers: "This allows persons to choose from a variety of private care providers rather than having the heartless government bureaucrats impose their one-size-fits-all program on them."