MoveOn.org Gun Owners for Gun Control meet with D.C. pols

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http://www.wkyt.com/home/headlines/Kent ... 82111.html
WASHINGTON, DC (WKYT) - Gun owners from across the country traveled to DC this week to urge the Obama administration to strengthen gun laws. The MoveOn.org Gun Owners for Gun Control organization had a delegation of 15 meet with White House officials and respective Congressmen from their states.

A few gun owners are working to make it more difficult for Americans to get guns. Grant Short, from Paint Lick, KY, says he loves owning guns, but he also says it is wrong that any person that wants to can walk into a gun show and purchase a firearm with cash. He wants to work with the Obama administration to change that.

"I just don’t think people are fully aware of how big that loophole is and how many criminals take advantage of it,” said Short.
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Re: MoveOn.org Gun Owners for Gun Control meet with D.C. pol

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To determine whether UBC will result in wholesale confiscations, we have to look at the states who have it and see how much confiscation has gone on.

Confiscation is the only real argument against UBC. Yes: it costs money. This is a legitimate premise to address. However, I think the "confiscation" thing is a snipe hunt. It has been, however, wildly successful in derailing UBC.

Again: look at the states where it exists and arrive at a conclusion.

CDFingers
Neoliberals are cowards

Re: MoveOn.org Gun Owners for Gun Control meet with D.C. pol

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Bacchus wrote:I would want to know first how many criminals DO purchase guns at gun shows and then commit crimes with them.
I would want to see that data as well.
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Re: MoveOn.org Gun Owners for Gun Control meet with D.C. pol

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CDFingers wrote:To determine whether UBC will result in wholesale confiscations, we have to look at the states who have it and see how much confiscation has gone on.

Confiscation is the only real argument against UBC. Yes: it costs money. This is a legitimate premise to address. However, I think the "confiscation" thing is a snipe hunt. It has been, however, wildly successful in derailing UBC.

Again: look at the states where it exists and arrive at a conclusion.

CDFingers
The point is if Background Checks work in the manner desired. There are 17 states with background checks. Is there a significant reduction in violent crime there?

Re: MoveOn.org Gun Owners for Gun Control meet with D.C. pol

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BKinzey wrote:The point is if Background Checks work in the manner desired. There are 17 states with background checks. Is there a significant reduction in violent crime there?
Yes, OK: let's look.

Federal background check 1994 for all sales through FFL's.
NICS 1998

http://smartgunlaws.org/background-chec ... y-summary/

California background check law 1993

http://www.mercurynews.com/ci_22483537/ ... e-national

Now, let's look at "violent" crime:

Image


link:

https://oag.ca.gov/crime

Now, it might be neat to seize upon this as Eureka! We have the answer. But correlation is not causation. This stat exists. Whether the improved economy had anything to do with the reduction is one option to consider. Another is things seemed to sort of plateau a bit after 9/11. Correlation is not causation. I had an ingrown toenail that got infected in 2013, but I got it fixed. Right away the crime rate began to decrease...

CDFingers
Neoliberals are cowards

Re: MoveOn.org Gun Owners for Gun Control meet with D.C. pol

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ATF says straw purchasers, corrupt gun dealers are biggest suppliers of firearms to criminals.

"ATF officials say that only about 8% of the nation's 124,000 retail gun dealers sell the majority of handguns that are used in crimes."
Hot Guns: How criminals get guns
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline ... /guns.html
"When and if fascism comes to America... it will be called, of course, ‘Americanism'." - Halford Luccock
"Liberty without socialism is privilege and injustice. Socialism without liberty is slavery and brutality."
— Mikhail Bakunin

Re: MoveOn.org Gun Owners for Gun Control meet with D.C. pol

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SilasSoule wrote:ATF says straw purchasers, corrupt gun dealers are biggest suppliers of firearms to criminals.

"ATF officials say that only about 8% of the nation's 124,000 retail gun dealers sell the majority of handguns that are used in crimes."
Hot Guns: How criminals get guns
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline ... /guns.html
And of those 8%, how many of them are in high crime cities? You know that California, Arizona, and Texas lead in firearms that end up in Mexico. Location, location, location, does have an affect.

If the ATF were tossed into the mix I wonder where they would show up? ;)

Re: MoveOn.org Gun Owners for Gun Control meet with D.C. pol

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BKinzey wrote:
SilasSoule wrote:ATF says straw purchasers, corrupt gun dealers are biggest suppliers of firearms to criminals.

"ATF officials say that only about 8% of the nation's 124,000 retail gun dealers sell the majority of handguns that are used in crimes."
Hot Guns: How criminals get guns
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline ... /guns.html
And of those 8%, how many of them are in high crime cities? You know that California, Arizona, and Texas lead in firearms that end up in Mexico. Location, location, location, does have an affect.

If the ATF were tossed into the mix I wonder where they would show up? ;)
I do not find it odd, this stat. When we consider that CA, AZ, and TX border Mexico, we understand why South Dakota does not have all kinds of guns show up in Mexico...

Yes: straw purchases are illegal. Stopping them falls upon the gun dealer, as it should.

CDFingers
Neoliberals are cowards

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