The Liberal Gun Club Forum

The victim, Akai Gurley, 28, had spent the evening at his girlfriend’s apartment inside the Louis Pink housing projects, Bratton told reporters at a press conference. The couple left the seventh floor apartment around 11:15 p.m. and tried to take an elevator down to the bottom floor. When the elevator wouldn’t work, they entered the stairwell.

Two officers, meanwhile, were conducting a vertical patrol -- also known as a top to bottom patrol -- inside the building. Upon entering the "dark" stairwell on the eighth floor, Bratton said, Officer Peter Liang drew his gun and flashlight as a safety precaution. That's when Gurley and his girlfriend -- identified by the New York Daily News as Melissa Butler -- also entered the stairwell.

At that moment, Liang fired one round from the eighth floor landing. Gurley, who was on the seventh floor landing, was struck in the chest.

SwampGrouch wrote:I doubt there's any question that Liang fucked up, but how do you conclude a lack of trigger discipline from that article?

If we're going to speculate as to cause, I'd say it was a fundamental shoot-don't shoot judgement failure, it based on failing to discern whether or not the person was a threat.

A staircase is a scary place, especially for an amped up rookie.

Bratton said that according to a preliminary investigation, "it appears this may have been an accidental discharge."

New York City

In 1971, police officers in New York City shot 314 people, killing 93. (In California, the state with the most police involved shootings in 2011, the police shot 183, killing 102.) In 2010, New York City police shot 24, killing 8. Last year, in the nation's largest city, the police shot 16, killing 6. In Columbus, Ohio, a city one eighth the size of New York, the police shot 14, killing 8. Statistical diversities like this suggest that in the cities with the highest per capita shooting rates, better people ought to be hired, or the existing forces need a lot more training in the use of deadly force.

SwampGrouch wrote:

Bratton said that according to a preliminary investigation, "it appears this may have been an accidental discharge."

Emphasis mine

You cannot discern from the facts presented where Liang's trigger finger was. There is, however, no doubt that he did not correctly identify his target in terms of being a threat.

TrueTexan wrote:I think we know where the trigger finger was, unless the gun was one of those auto firing Glocks that cause Glock Leg.

fknauss wrote:Hey, I read Stranger in a Strange land too!

MudPuppy98 wrote:I get that it it was possibly unintended, but accidental really doesn't cover situations like this. Negligent is a better term.

A non-LEO citizen would be in jail right now in those circumstances in NYC.

Officer Liang is left-handed, and he tried to turn the knob of the door that opens to the stairwell with that hand while also holding the gun, according to a high-ranking police official who was familiar with the investigation and who emphasized that the account could change.

It appears that in turning the knob and pushing the door open, Officer Liang rotated the barrel of the gun down and accidentally fired, the official said. He and the other officer both jumped back into the hallway, and Officer Liang shouted something to the effect that he had accidentally fired his weapon, the official said.

Why do I feel like the NYPD is the biggest "gang" out there, killing innocent people, at random? I mean, isn't that the definition of mass killers? Instead of spending $50 billion on Moms, Bloomers should have paid for the entire NYPD to receive the best and state of the art firearms training. After all, he was the Mayor of NY. They are mass killers at his direction.

fknauss wrote:Hey, I read Stranger in a Strange land too!

beto wrote:First New York has a strong anti-gun culture and most of the Police are likely recruited in City. There is a Hollywood gun culture of blasting away at anything. This is what the recruits are exposed to, not responsible gun handling as a child. I would be willing to bet that NYC hate of guns extends to the extent that the officers do not get enough training and practice to use their forearms appropriately. This is speculation but it is based on observations.

MudPuppy98 wrote:I get that it it was possibly unintended, but accidental really doesn't cover situations like this. Negligent is a better term.

A non-LEO citizen would be in jail right now in those circumstances in NYC.

brandonsmash wrote:

MudPuppy98 wrote:I get that it it was possibly unintended, but accidental really doesn't cover situations like this. Negligent is a better term.

A non-LEO citizen would be in jail right now in those circumstances in NYC.

Correct. It was not "accidental." At the very least it was manslaughter.

Kyluckyman wrote:Guns do not simply discharge without a finger pressing against the trigger.