MountainSquid wrote:Wabatuckian wrote: So what's a mind with TSA agents at the gates..?
Theatrical
And some of us can multitaskJinxRemoving wrote: When I'm cooking, I'm an excellent cook. When I'm driving, I'man excellent driver. When I'm cooking and driving at the same time, I'm doing a piss-poor job of both, and endangering people at the same time.
There are jobs that require attention, focus, and vigilance: teaching and security BOTH fall into that category, and expecting one person to fulfill both roles for a classroom is unrealistic and accepting of the fact that they willbe marginal at best in either duty.
Nicely put, Jinx.JinxRemoving wrote:When I'm cooking, I'm an excellent cook. When I'm driving, I'man excellent driver. When I'm cooking and driving at the same time, I'm doing a piss-poor job of both, and endangering people at the same time.
There are jobs that require attention, focus, and vigilance: teaching and security BOTH fall into that category, and expecting one person to fulfill both roles for a classroom is unrealistic and accepting of the fact that they willbe marginal at best in either duty.
I knew something like that existed, but I didn't know it had a name. Thanks, Jim.JimInATX wrote:Just a thought: the availability heuristic is a huge obstacle to having an objective, facts-based discussion on gun rights/control: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Availability_heuristic
It's definitely relevant to the point you made earlier.SwampGrouch wrote:I knew something like that existed, but I didn't know it had a name. Thanks, Jim.JimInATX wrote:Just a thought: the availability heuristic is a huge obstacle to having an objective, facts-based discussion on gun rights/control: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Availability_heuristic
I would also go on-record as stating that, while trained teachers would be great, I highly doubt if I could find ONE elementary school teacher at my son's school who would carry even if they had the skills.Let’s contemplate the following outline and summary of Dave Grossman’s “Five D’s.” While you do, I encourage you to add in the comments area below your suggestions to address, and expand upon, these ideas.
1. Denial — Denial is the enemy and it has no survival value, said Grossman.
2. Deter — Put police officers in schools, because with just one officer assigned to a school, the probability of a mass murder in that school drops to almost zero
3. Detect — We’re talking about plain old fashioned police work here. The ultimate achievement for law enforcement is the crime that didn’t happen, so giving teachers and administrators regular access to cops is paramount.
4. Delay — Various simple mechanisms can be used by teachers and cops to put time and distance between the killers and the kids.
a. Ensure that the school/classroom have just a single point of entry. Simply locking the back door helps create a hard target.
b. Conduct your active shooter drills within (and in partnership with) the schools in your city so teachers know how to respond, and know what it looks like when you do your response.
5. Destroy — Police officers and agencies should consider the following:
a. Carry off duty. No one would tell a firefighter who has a fire extinguisher in his trunk that he’s crazy or paranoid.
b. Equip every cop in America with a patrol rifle. One chief of police, upon getting rifles for all his officers once said, “If an active killer strikes in my town, the response time will be measured in feet per second.”
c. Put smoke grenades in the trunk of every cop car in America. Any infantryman who needs to attack across open terrain or perform a rescue under fire deploys a smoke grenade. A fire extinguisher will do a decent job in some cases, but a smoke grenade is designed to perform the function.
d. Have a “go-to-war bag” filled with lots of loaded magazines and supplies for tactical combat casualty care.
e. Use helicopters. Somewhere in your county you probably have one or more of the following: medevac, media, private, national guard, coast guard rotors.
f. Employ the crew-served, continuous-feed, weapon you already have available to you (a firehouse) by integrating the fire service into your active shooter training. It is virtually impossible for a killer to put well-placed shots on target while also being blasted with water at 300 pounds per square inch.
g. Armed citizens can help. Think United 93. Whatever your personal take on gun control, it is all but certain that a killer set on killing is more likely to attack a target where the citizens are unarmed, rather than one where they are likely to encounter an armed citizen response.
No solution is going to be perfect. I would say that the blasting his way into the school would do a pretty good job of alerting an officer/trained security person in the school and give them an opportunity to set up a shot in the first main hall. I would guess quite a few lives would be saved just by having any armed response, even misses. Shooting is a little different when the bullets are going both ways. (That's why I am a nurse now instead of retired from the corps...)mark wrote:goalie, I agree with some of that post. But this guy blasted his way into school, so the single point entry probably wouldn't make a huge difference. However, I think that making schools a harder targets by including some of what you mention and some other things is a good general practice to help avoid another school shooting. But what about all of the other shootings? The mall, the movie theater, the university, etc? I think its important to keep our kids safe but when we are talking about gun safety in general it must be bigger picture than that.
Another point to consider is that I know people who have taught middle school in rural areas with no air conditioning. In the south. There are some really really really poor school districts. They can't afford basic building upkeep, they ain't gonna install bulletproof glass and the like. Its a complex problem for sure.
I can't argue with that. LOL.goalie wrote: It's a little different than here in MN.
Not to sound like a sicko, but then it might be a good thing that these mass-shootings at school seem to be happening in affluent neighborhoods.mark wrote:I can't argue with that. LOL.goalie wrote: It's a little different than here in MN.
Still, I think the poverty thing is the major roadblock to implement these ideas, as good as some of them might be. Until we fund our schools equally, regardless of how nice the parents' houses are, then we are going to have shitty poor schools and exclusive rich schools. All publicly funded. Just unevenly.
mark wrote:goalie, I agree with some of that post. But this guy blasted his way into school, so the single point entry probably wouldn't make a huge difference. However, I think that making schools a harder targets by including some of what you mention and some other things is a good general practice to help avoid another school shooting. But what about all of the other shootings? The mall, the movie theater, the university, etc? I think its important to keep our kids safe but when we are talking about gun safety in general it must be bigger picture than that.
Another point to consider is that I know people who have taught middle school in rural areas with no air conditioning. In the south. There are some really really really poor school districts. They can't afford basic building upkeep, they ain't gonna install bulletproof glass and the like. Its a complex problem for sure.
whitey wrote:Why wouldn't the criminal just wait till the officer leaves to attack the school?
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