highdesert wrote: Wed Nov 06, 2024 10:32 am I'm also very concerned about Ukraine, the Middle East, NATO...

DisillusionedGOP wrote: Wed Nov 06, 2024 11:35 am This election was important because of court picks. The downsizing of government and the expansion of personal rights has been through the courts. Not through any lawmaker. Harris wouldn't have appointed judges that support personal freedoms and the downsizing of government. Trump is an authoritarian, but court picks are more important right now. Bruen wouldn't have happened with Democrat court picks.

featureless wrote: Wed Nov 06, 2024 12:13 pm The "economy is really good" misses a few things. Yes, inflation has cooled, but prices are still going up, not down. Insurance (medical, auto, fire, hurricane) is getting off the charts expensive and isn't considered in most economic discussions. Housing remains astronomical. Between those, the economy fucking sucks for a lot of people, despite what the inflation or jobs numbers say.

Bisbee wrote: Wed Nov 06, 2024 12:23 pm

featureless wrote: Wed Nov 06, 2024 12:13 pm The "economy is really good" misses a few things. Yes, inflation has cooled, but prices are still going up, not down. Insurance (medical, auto, fire, hurricane) is getting off the charts expensive and isn't considered in most economic discussions. Housing remains astronomical. Between those, the economy fucking sucks for a lot of people, despite what the inflation or jobs numbers say.

When one millionaire rakes it in while one hundred families suffers food and housing insecurity, the economy still looks good on paper. That is what this election is showing us in stark terms. Each person still gets one vote. The average American apparently is not benefitting from the “soft landing” at all. And this fell for the empty words of a con-artist who promised them the Moon.

featureless wrote: Wed Nov 06, 2024 12:31 pm Apparently, people will vote for what they perceive as the least bad option. Dems needed a better alternative. They've become too enamoured of the donor class and forgotten the kitchen table.

Nomadsurfer wrote: Wed Nov 06, 2024 12:38 pm Well, if you think things are expensive now, wait until Trump’s tariffs start, he deports all the cheap labor, and lets Leon Murk cut the government’s spending budget…

Not to mention the other foreign affairs stuff…

Buckle up

The voters in the 2024 presidential election were looking for a leader and someone who could bring needed change, and for that change they looked back to former President Donald Trump.

He was propelled by an electorate dissatisfied with the state of the country, the economy and by the many voters who were feeling the impact of inflation.

Vice President Kamala Harris underperformed with key parts of the Democratic coalition, while Trump made some inroads. He also continued to excel with some groups who have historically backed him, keeping his coalition largely intact.

The ability to lead and to be someone who can bring needed change were the top two candidate qualities for voters — and Trump won them handily.

Two thirds of voters described the economy as bad, and those voters who did went big for Trump. And on a personal level, more said they were worse off financially compared to four years ago — and 8 in 10 of those voters backed Trump. Most said inflation was a hardship, including nearly a quarter who said the hardship was severe.

On issues, the state of democracy and the economy were the top concerns for voters. And while most voters said they wanted abortion to be legal, the issue did not rise to the top for voters.

Harris led Trump among those who said abortion should be legal, but Trump did capture 28% of those voters, indicating these voters' position on the issue was not as salient when it came to their vote choice. Harris lost some support among some traditional Democratic coalition groups, while Trump held much of his coalition together.

Trump also targeted marginal voters in his campaign and nationally, the voters who did not vote in the 2020 presidential election voted for him over Harris.

Trump made inroads with some parts of the Democratic coalition, including young voters, and particularly young men under age 30. In particular, in Wisconsin and Pennsylvania — states where Mr. Biden won voters age 18-29 by double digits —Harris' margins were far smaller. In Pennsylvania, Trump did well with younger men, a group Mr. Biden won in this state by 9 points. Much of Harris' less than robust performance with voters 18-29 was due to the fact that Trump performed better with younger men than he did in 2020.

Wurble wrote: Wed Nov 06, 2024 5:15 pm 2025-??? will not be the same as 2017-2020. In 2017, there were still "adults" in the room. People who, while very conservative, at least believed in the rule of law and the constitution.

Not this time. Trump has rid himself of those folks. All that are left are sycophants and fellow grifters. Trump will NOT relinquish power at the "end" of this term.

Additionally, both January 6th, and the Supreme Court ruling on Presidential Immunity have given Trump a license to do literally anything he wants. Expect any media organization that speaks out against him to be shut down. Expect any prominent figures speaking out against him to be doxxed publicly on X with a call to his followers to "take care of them." The country can and will turn into a 3rd world nation faster than you can blink your eyes.

Do not expect to be ABLE to vote in 2028.

Nomadsurfer wrote: Wed Nov 06, 2024 6:53 pm

Wurble wrote: Wed Nov 06, 2024 5:15 pm 2025-??? will not be the same as 2017-2020. In 2017, there were still "adults" in the room. People who, while very conservative, at least believed in the rule of law and the constitution.

Not this time. Trump has rid himself of those folks. All that are left are sycophants and fellow grifters. Trump will NOT relinquish power at the "end" of this term.

Additionally, both January 6th, and the Supreme Court ruling on Presidential Immunity have given Trump a license to do literally anything he wants. Expect any media organization that speaks out against him to be shut down. Expect any prominent figures speaking out against him to be doxxed publicly on X with a call to his followers to "take care of them." The country can and will turn into a 3rd world nation faster than you can blink your eyes.

Do not expect to be ABLE to vote in 2028.

While I share your fears about his lack of babysitters this time, I have already told anyone in my circle who voted for him NOT to come to me for help.

If they voted for this fool, for whatever reason, they own all of it.

Any farmer who goes bankrupt through tariffs, any worker who gets laid off thanks to Elon cutting unions and intentionally ruining the economy, any family who loses their siblings when they get deported, anyone whose social security benefits get canceled, and anyone who’s daughter gets sick or dies from a lack of healthcare can go suck eggs.


Sorry not sorry.

I apologize if this upsets anyone here, but I am personally out of fucks to give and lines are being drawn. I’m not advocating violence by any means. Rather, stern accountability and comeuppance. Extra tough love, if you will.

Like I tell my boy, I warned you, if you don’t listen, don’t come crying to me…

The dust has not yet settled from the 2024 election, but the Democratic Party's blame game over their bleak showing has already begun in earnest. Democrats across the ideological spectrum are quickly seizing on this raw moment to try to redefine the party in their image. "Instead of saying, 'How can people vote for Donald Trump,' we should be asking 'Why do people vote for Donald Trump'... what did he do right and what did we do wrong," Rep. Tom Suozzi (D-N.Y.) told Axios. Sen. Bernie Sanders (I-Vt.) released a scathing statement alleging the Democratic Party "abandoned" the working class, Axios' Stephen Neukam reported. "Will the big-money interests and well-paid consultants who control the Democratic Party learn any real lesson from this disastrous campaign? ... Probably not," Sanders said. Several other progressive members of Congress, such as Reps. Jamaal Bowman (D-N.Y.) and Ro Khanna (D-Calif.), offered similar critiques of the party's approach. "There were a lot of mistakes," Bowman told Axios.

Suozzi, a moderate, told Axios, "We have to stop pandering to the base and we have to start listening to the people ... people are sick of extremism." Suozzi predicted that he is "going to get beaten up" for his post-election takes. "The far-left is going to say it's because Kamala Harris was a war hawk ... they'll try, but I think no one's buying it," said another House Democrat. Democrats are feeling dejected and shellshocked by the decisive loss of the White House and Senate. "It was not what any of us expected, and it was certainly not what I was hoping for," said Rep. Brad Schneider (D-Ill.). Some House Democrats are hanging onto the slim hope that they can keep the House and deny President-elect Trump full control of Congress, but others acknowledge that is a tough needle to thread. "Their pathway is wider and ours is narrow," said Suozzi. Another House Democrat predicted "the best case" for Democrats is that they will be just one seat short of a majority.
Several House Democrats, speaking on the condition of anonymity, argued the outcome is a less a pox on an ideological branch of the Democratic Party than on its leadership.

One House Democrat took aim at Democratic National Committee chair Jaime Harrison and Senate Majority Leader Chuck Schumer (D-N.Y.), asking, "Is that the future of the Democratic Party?" Another said they mostly blame Vice President Harris, but that they are "not sure [President] Biden would have been any better." A third House Democrat said Harris "didn't really engage with moderates" in Congress and faulted Biden for "failing to leave early enough." House Democratic leadership seems to be getting a pass from its members, with few popping up to blame House Minority Leader Hakeem Jeffries (D-N.Y.) or his deputies. Jeffries, Minority Whip Katherine Clark (D-Mass.) and Democratic Caucus Chair Pete Aguilar (D-Calif.) have "done a great job," said Schneider, adding, "I don't think anyone is looking at them." Democrats are also starting to quibble over how the party should recalibrate its approach to Trump during his second go-around. One House Democrat said the party needs "pick and choose our battles" and get past "this idea they call 'Trump Derangement Syndrome'." "Democrats just literally attacked everything he did. We could never agree with anything, never give him credit for anything, could never say, 'Well actually securing the border is a good idea, I just disagree with how he's doing it,'" the lawmaker said. One senior House Democrat warned of the inevitable post-mortem, "It'll be tough."

Vice President Harris faced voters who were hungry for change and thought the country was headed in the wrong direction — fierce headwinds that proved insurmountable. She also faced a major political realignment, with Democratic losses up and down the ballot and across the map. Why it matters: Top Democrats tell us the brutal environment — combined with President-elect Trump's harnessing of voter concerns about immigration and inflation — doomed her candidacy in an election that polled 50-50 to the very end. Harris inherited long odds from a deeply unpopular President Biden, and powered a 100-day campaign blitz that — by every traditional metric — was teeming with enthusiasm. The campaign's internal data projects the seven battlegrounds shifted between 3 and 8 points in her direction from July 21 to Election Day — an impressive feat, but one that will be buried by the front pages of history.

Democrats across the country lost ground across virtually every demographic, with deep-blue states — including New York and New Jersey — swinging sharply right. "Voters in 2024 were looking for a change, and the broader electoral environment greatly favored Republicans," a top Harris adviser told Axios. Public and private polling was broadly accurate, with no big polling miss like in 2016 and 2020. The Harris campaign always saw Michigan, Pennsylvania and Wisconsin as margin-of-error races that could break their way. But in the end — despite massive investment, a superior ground game and a deeply flawed opponent in Trump — the Blue Wall crumbled. In poll after poll, roughly two-thirds of voters thought the country was headed in the wrong direction — a measure that historically has been predictive in presidential races.

In the last pre-election Gallup poll before the election, 72% of registered voters said they were dissatisfied with the way things are going in the country. Anti-immigration sentiment is at a two-decade high, according to Gallup, and Harris had no good answers for the Biden administration's much-maligned handling of the border crisis. Her early assignment to address the "root causes" of a surge in migrants entering the country made Republican attack lines especially potent. Arab American anger over Biden's support for Israel's wars in Gaza and Lebanon manifested in Michigan, while broader fears of global instability added to the anti-incumbent backlash.

Dearborn and Hamtramck, the two Michigan cities with the highest percentage of Arab Americans in the country, swung approximately 40 points away from Democrats between 2020 and 2024. Deep voter pessimism helped fuel presidential losses for the incumbent party in 1992, 2008 and 2016. It's also historically rare for two candidates from the same party to be elected in successive presidential elections, Democrats note. The story of anti-incumbency is an easy one for Democrats to tell themselves. Far more troubling is the dramatic gains Trump made with demographics that once wrote him off — the clearest sign that Democratic messaging is fundamentally broken.

DisillusionedGOP wrote: Wed Nov 06, 2024 11:35 am This election was important because of court picks. The downsizing of government and the expansion of personal rights has been through the courts. Not through any lawmaker. Harris wouldn't have appointed judges that support personal freedoms and the downsizing of government. Trump is an authoritarian, but court picks are more important right now. Bruen wouldn't have happened with Democrat court picks.