Like a lot of people, I did most of my first handgun shooting with 22 lr. Then I got a 357 mag and mostly used it for 38 spl. When I started shooting 357 mag, I developed a huge flinch.

Then I followed the CD Fingers No-Flinch plan -- load three rounds randomly in the 357 cylinder and shoot the whole cylinder. Plus lots of CDF-inspired snap capping at the light switches. Flinch gone.

I've been firing 44 mag lately, and just noticed I don't have a flinch. I do the same CDF drill to check myself. Nothing noticeable, and the groups are consistent with no flinch.

I would think 44 mag would be very flinch-inducing, and I can't explain this. Did breaking my flinch on 357 mag solve it for larger bores too? Or is it the difference in revolvers. My 357 is a single action Blackhawk, and my 44 is a double action Super Redhawk. They are both big beefy revolvers, but they have significantly different grips. The BH has a traditional single action grip, and it feels so natural to me. The SRH has a big beefy Hogue tamer grip, and of course a different grip angle/configuration altogether.

And of course, when I shoot 38 spl now out of the Blackhawk it feels like a cap gun.

Anyway, just musing over my coffee.

Fundamentals are just that, regardless of platform. Mine forever need improvement. Well done!

Ah, the joys of learning new things.

Long long away and far far ago there were two little kids living in the next apartment. The older was a girl who was in big kids school while the younger brother was, well young. And learning new skills often outside my window but out of sight of mom. The first time I watched him it was learning to jump, initially with one foot still on the grounds but soon with both feet. Later it was skipping; he had a really hard time with that and lots of scuffed knees but he kept trying until he could skip with the best of them. The biggie though was with his sisters jump rope; until she came home early one day and caught him trying to untangle it and get the knots out.

The Female of the species is more deadly than the Male; particularly when little brothers get the jump rope all tangled up.

.44 mag is a whole 'nuther kettle of fish. Goin' for saber toothed wildebeests, I expect. :0

CDFingers

CDFingers wrote: Sat Nov 18, 2023 11:29 am .44 mag is a whole 'nuther kettle of fish. Goin' for saber toothed wildebeests, I expect. :0

CDFingers

Yeah. I have no practical reason for this revolver, but i's been my gateway to reloading. And it's very fun.

Some people would argue that there is no practical reason for a revolver anymore, period. We tolerate a great deal of wrong-headed foolishness in America.

I noticed that I started to develop a flinch with my Blackhawk soon after I got it. It wasn't the recoil - it was the noise. I had been wearing muffs on their own - they were plenty for .22LR, and I hadn't had any issues with larger bore guns before. But I wasn't slinging 100 rounds of .45 downrange at a time, through a cylinder gap. I realized after the second trip out with it that I needed to double up on my ear pro, because I had a very low-grade ringing in my ears that persisted for the better part of the day. Plugs and muffs for me! Getting that sorted allowed me to focus more on grip and other fundamentals, rein the flinch in before it became a habit.

With the magnums, you have enough powder to keep accelerating through a carbine length barrel, pushing lead through the sound barrier, with the cylinder gap to boot. If your ear pro isn't on point to begin with, a flinch is inevitable. Recoil of course is a different problem, but a big gun mitigates a lot of that. So does a good grip - okay, both meanings here - and good stance. Might be more of a problem for people more accustomed to bottom-feeders with their springs and slides and doohickeys.

Me? If I didn't love the recoil, big guns wouldn't have near the appeal. Of course, I also love drilling some steel plates with a .22. Something for everyone, eh?

That's a good point about the noise. To repreat, ear plugs under muffs.

The reason for revolvers is that a double action revolver is the original point and click interface. It's safe all by itself and it's always ready with no prep. Some semi auto guys will fire with a two hand hold like they do with a semi, but they'll only do it once. They might need a tad of burn cream after. He he. If you're going to use two hands, which I don't, do cup and saucer to avoid the burn. But it's a hand gun, not a hands gun. He he.

CDFingers

Good point. The noise is definitely the biggest flinch inducer. That makes sense why moving from 44 to 357 isn’t a huge qualitative jump if you’ve tamed the noise.

CD fingers, so you prefer cup and saucer to support thumb over dominant thumb?

I find the latter keeps the recoil down better, but I could be wrong.

AlterCocker wrote: Tue Nov 21, 2023 12:55 pm CD fingers, so you prefer cup and saucer to support thumb over dominant thumb?

I find the latter keeps the recoil down better, but I could be wrong.

No. I prefer shooting hand guns one handed. I don't like two handed hand gun shooting because I'm so unfamiliar with it; I also find the thumb over thumb to feel awkard. I am totally familiar with one handed shooting. My most powerfully recoiling hand gun is my .45 single action revolver. Its plow handle properly held manages the recoil well. That is, I have to hold high up on the handle, and this allows the gun to roll in my hand rather than transferring all the recoil to my hand. I hold tightly with my ring finger and thumb with of course the other fingers doing their parts, but the ring/thumb squeeze forces the gun to roll rather than merely transferring the recoil straight back. I also shoot my .357 and 1911 one handed. The .357 recoils straight back, and it's sharp, but I'm used to it. With my single action revolver, I've loaded it with 10.5 grains of Unique under a 250 gr LRNFP. It rolled; it was stout; I could handle it--but I did not shoot up all the rounds I made, truth be told. It was stout. My normal load is 8.5 gr Unique under that 250 gr LRNFP. That is a very pleasant shoot, running at 950 fps. Pretty close to the origina design. Hope this helps.

CDFingers

CDFingers wrote: Tue Nov 21, 2023 5:53 pm

AlterCocker wrote: Tue Nov 21, 2023 12:55 pm CD fingers, so you prefer cup and saucer to support thumb over dominant thumb?

I find the latter keeps the recoil down better, but I could be wrong.

No. I prefer shooting hand guns one handed. I don't like two handed hand gun shooting because I'm so unfamiliar with it; I also find the thumb over thumb to feel awkard. I am totally familiar with one handed shooting. My most powerfully recoiling hand gun is my .45 single action revolver. Its plow handle properly held manages the recoil well. That is, I have to hold high up on the handle, and this allows the gun to roll in my hand rather than transferring all the recoil to my hand. I hold tightly with my ring finger and thumb with of course the other fingers doing their parts, but the ring/thumb squeeze forces the gun to roll rather than merely transferring the recoil straight back. I also shoot my .357 and 1911 one handed. The .357 recoils straight back, and it's sharp, but I'm used to it. With my single action revolver, I've loaded it with 10.5 grains of Unique under a 250 gr LRNFP. It rolled; it was stout; I could handle it--but I did not shoot up all the rounds I made, truth be told. It was stout. My normal load is 8.5 gr Unique under that 250 gr LRNFP. That is a very pleasant shoot, running at 950 fps. Pretty close to the origina design. Hope this helps.

CDFingers

Are you able to cock the hammer with your shooting hand without altering your grip? That has been my challenge. I replaced my Blackhawk hammer with a Super Blackhawk hammer -- it's got a lower hammer spur that's easier to reach with the thumb. But I still have to alter my grip to cock then readjust to shoot. Maybe I'm just not high enough on the grip? I have pretty average sized hands I think.

One handed is fine, but I'm not as accurate with it yet. To do it in proper historic style, one should use it in the off hand, with a saber in the other. I don't have a saber yet.

I was taught to use the thumbs forward grip even on revolvers, but with care to make sure to stay clear of the cylinder gap. It's fine and it helps stabilize the grip for thumb cocking, but part of the appeal for my Blackhawk was the lowered Bisley type hammer spur.

What works best for me - YMMV - is the double-action Magnum grip. Instead of getting the support thumb forward on the frame for increased surface contact, I lock it down over the other thumb below the joint. This gives me a stronger grip and seems to minimize any wander from my suboptimal trigger pull. Or flinching. It has the fringe benefit of placing the support thumb perfectly for cocking the hammer as the barrel comes back down without shifting grip. It makes for a quick reset.

cooper wrote: Wed Nov 22, 2023 3:14 am

CDFingers wrote: Tue Nov 21, 2023 5:53 pm

AlterCocker wrote: Tue Nov 21, 2023 12:55 pm CD fingers, so you prefer cup and saucer to support thumb over dominant thumb?

I find the latter keeps the recoil down better, but I could be wrong.

No. I prefer shooting hand guns one handed. I don't like two handed hand gun shooting because I'm so unfamiliar with it; I also find the thumb over thumb to feel awkard. I am totally familiar with one handed shooting. My most powerfully recoiling hand gun is my .45 single action revolver. Its plow handle properly held manages the recoil well. That is, I have to hold high up on the handle, and this allows the gun to roll in my hand rather than transferring all the recoil to my hand. I hold tightly with my ring finger and thumb with of course the other fingers doing their parts, but the ring/thumb squeeze forces the gun to roll rather than merely transferring the recoil straight back. I also shoot my .357 and 1911 one handed. The .357 recoils straight back, and it's sharp, but I'm used to it. With my single action revolver, I've loaded it with 10.5 grains of Unique under a 250 gr LRNFP. It rolled; it was stout; I could handle it--but I did not shoot up all the rounds I made, truth be told. It was stout. My normal load is 8.5 gr Unique under that 250 gr LRNFP. That is a very pleasant shoot, running at 950 fps. Pretty close to the origina design. Hope this helps.

CDFingers

Are you able to cock the hammer with your shooting hand without altering your grip? That has been my challenge. I replaced my Blackhawk hammer with a Super Blackhawk hammer -- it's got a lower hammer spur that's easier to reach with the thumb. But I still have to alter my grip to cock then readjust to shoot. Maybe I'm just not high enough on the grip? I have pretty average sized hands I think.

Yes, easily I can cock it with one hand. I hook my thumb over the Vaquero hammer and fling the gun forward, sort of following the same arc as it took when it rotated backwards during the shot. The momentum does the cocking for me.

CDFingers

Thanks, CD, I'll pay more attention to my grip when shooting one-handed and see if that method works. I currently do the two-handed grip that wings described.