Getting a license to purchase and carry a firearm in the Czech Republic

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It's a Washington Post article so it has a certain anti-gun bias.
By European standards, its gun laws are permissive. It allows people to carry concealed weapons for the purpose of self-defense, and it is one of the few countries in the world — and the only one in Europe — that provide the constitutional right to bear arms. But exercising that right is contingent on the test. Czech lawmakers and gun owners say their national system dramatically increases the odds of responsible ownership. The rules also require a health clearance and a background check, and demand safe storage of weapons once they are purchased. In a country more populous than New York City, there were seven homicides using guns during all of last year. “We really have bad politics in many ways here — corruption. But something I am proud of is this law,” said Martin Fiser, 35, a weapons instructor. “It can be a model for the rest of the world.”
The test is obligatory for anybody who wants a weapon, including hunters, collectors, even someone inheriting a shotgun from a grandfather. The standards are high: The test consists of questions randomly drawn from a pool of 501 possible. Those trying to obtain the hardest-to-get license — for concealed carry — can miss no more than one question. The failure rate is around 40 percent.
Czech lawmakers say they have a luxury that Americans do not. Guns are not a politically fraught issue. About 1 in every 30 Czechs hold a gun permit. For most of the rest, the issue is rarely discussed. The constitutional right to bear arms was put in place only last year, not because of some popular groundswell, but because lawmakers liked the national laws as they stand and wanted to make sure E.U. initiatives passed in response to terrorist attacks wouldn’t jeopardize them. “Guns are valued by gun holders,” said Martin Cervicek, a senator and former president of the Czech police forces. “But they are not viewed as sacred.”
The Czech national testing system was born in the vacuum of the 1989 Communist collapse. The Communists had decreed that guns could be licensed only to those proving capability. But in practice almost nobody aside from police and party apparatchiks had been able to get one. As the new Czech democracy tried to interpret that vague law, local police started conducting examinations. Within a few years, the system was formalized: a written and practical test, overseen by a government-appointed commissar. The country has regularly expanded the pool of possible questions for test-takers. The Czech Interior Ministry, which oversees the testing system, did not allow The Washington Post to sit in on tests. But it shared uncut videos of several testing sessions, which take place at gun centers across the country, generally in groups of 15 to 20 people.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/20 ... -republic/
https://archive.ph/uBwZR

California's Firearms Safety Certificate to purchase a firearm is 30 questions but it's not timed. I don't think it's difficult but CDF has more experience with it.
"Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but not their own facts." - Daniel Patrick Moynihan

Re: Getting a license to purchase and carry a firearm in the Czech Republic

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I'll get pillored for this but why not a written and practical test to buy a gun? Required already for concealed carry in a lot of states. Works for driving. Easy access is a BIG problem here in the good 'ole' USofA. Vast majority of 'mass shootings' were men who obtained their gun legally. Sometimes that morning(Wallmart shooter in Chesapeake). Yes, yes, 'traveling but not driving is a 'right', gu ownership is a much discussed 'right'.

Re: Getting a license to purchase and carry a firearm in the Czech Republic

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The California firearms safety certificate test I found to be easy--all correct. The last gun I bought, my 1911, was bought under that certificate. I still have it in my wallet, though it is now expired. If I wanted to buy another gun--not needed to possess, just to purchase--I'd go back to the same gun shop and take the test again. I do not know of the failure rate. I think it an OK gate keeper. I did not know they had the RKBA, but that Czech permit seems a good thing. I'd like to see their battery of questions for kicks and giggles.

https://oag.ca.gov/firearms/fsc

CDFingers
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Re: Getting a license to purchase and carry a firearm in the Czech Republic

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I acknowledge that there are reasons other countries do have requirements even after enacting a "new constitutional" right like the Czech's. However, I find it difficult to see this as a path in our country, unless we apply the same standard to other rights including the first amendment. Are we ready to test individuals on their right to express free thought? I personally find it difficult to carve out exceptions on any right. Doing so makes it less of a right and more of a privilege. Other countries have different reasons for coming to a position and the Czech's only adopted a second amendment to circumvent eventual EU restrictions. I doubt their approach will work since the EU will insist the EU "constitution" overrules local constitutions. The only purpose this has in our discussion is to give a weapon to those who want to use Czech example as way to insist we need more restrictions on the second amendment.
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"Resistance is futile. You will be assimilated!" Loquacious of many. Texas Chapter Chief Cat Herder.

Re: Getting a license to purchase and carry a firearm in the Czech Republic

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I was thinking about the same thing CDF when I was out. This appears to be an old pool of questions no long used. If you put the URL into Google Translate you can see it in English. It also has the answers at the bottom.
http://www.mujglock.com/_download/zkuse ... z-mvcr.htm

http://www.mujglock.com/en/test-questio ... cence.html

They have to answer 30 questions selected from a pool of 501 questions, in 40 minutes.

They have roughly 353,000 gun owners in a population of over almost 11 million. If the Russkies start moving West, the Czechs are much better armed than the UK.
"Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but not their own facts." - Daniel Patrick Moynihan

Re: Getting a license to purchase and carry a firearm in the Czech Republic

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highdesert wrote: Sun Nov 27, 2022 11:39 am I was thinking about the same thing CDF when I was out. This appears to be an old pool of questions no long used. If you put the URL into Google Translate you can see it in English. It also has the answers at the bottom.
http://www.mujglock.com/_download/zkuse ... z-mvcr.htm

http://www.mujglock.com/en/test-questio ... cence.html

They have to answer 30 questions selected from a pool of 501 questions, in 40 minutes.

They have roughly 353,000 gun owners in a population of over almost 11 million. If the Russkies start moving West, the Czechs are much better armed than the UK.
Still begs the question, what other bill of rights numerated rights would you be willing to subject to a written test. While voting is not a numerated right people would be up in “arms” if someone suggested a written test to vote. If gun ownership and possession becomes subject to a written test, I insist voting becomes subject to a written test too. Is it too much to ask people understand the constitution and laws in general. Not really questions.
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"Resistance is futile. You will be assimilated!" Loquacious of many. Texas Chapter Chief Cat Herder.

Re: Getting a license to purchase and carry a firearm in the Czech Republic

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I'm not advocating for the Czech type licensing to purchase guns and for concealed carry. It's their system that seems to work for all political parties in their republic. We have a different constitution and laws in regard to firearms that's very different from our two closest neighbors, Canada and Mexico. I'm for talking about firearms laws in other countries including criticisms of their systems, discussion doesn't mean advocacy.
"Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but not their own facts." - Daniel Patrick Moynihan

Re: Getting a license to purchase and carry a firearm in the Czech Republic

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highdesert wrote: Sun Nov 27, 2022 5:34 pm I'm not advocating for the Czech type licensing to purchase guns and for concealed carry. It's their system that seems to work for all political parties in their republic. We have a different constitution and laws in regard to firearms that's very different from our two closest neighbors, Canada and Mexico. I'm for talking about firearms laws in other countries including criticisms of their systems, discussion doesn't mean advocacy.
True enough, I just get a bit edgy on these discussions since I’m pretty sure where the gun prohibitionists would go with these type restrictions. To the prohibitionists it’s a step toward a system where gun ownership becomes a limited privilege for only the approved right kind of people. BTW, didn’t mean to imply you were advocating such.
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"Resistance is futile. You will be assimilated!" Loquacious of many. Texas Chapter Chief Cat Herder.

Re: Getting a license to purchase and carry a firearm in the Czech Republic

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I think their regulations are great policy. They work for Czechia. Whether they could work here is a different question, because our cultures and context are different.

I resented the idea that I needed to pass an 8 hour class with two hours on the range to be able to legally carry a concealed handgun back in the day, as a limitation of my 2A rights - but I also recognized the public safety aspects and strongly support training. I consider mandatory training requirements, provided in a safe and carefully regulated context, free of charge through the state, to be an optimal solution to the rights/responsibility dilemma. Putting gun training in the high schools doesn't seem to be a politically viable approach for a variety of reasons though.

Representational government is going to factionalize policy every time, so my opinions on good gun policy don't matter a whit so long as they're tied to unrelated policies on trade, immigration, civil rights, national defense, etc. Reasons I'm a fan of popular initiatives and direct democracy. It's the only way to make parties listen to the people.

Re: Getting a license to purchase and carry a firearm in the Czech Republic

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What do firearms owners really need to know? How safely to load and unload the weapon. How to operate it safely. How to clean it. How safely to store it. Where it may and may not be carried openly or concealed. And The Four Rules.

We can look here to detect whether the above is worthy of consideration, whether to develop an LGC template on tissue paper:

https://www.etymonline.com/word/infringe

CDFingers
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While the firelight's aglow strange shadows from the flames will grow
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Re: Getting a license to purchase and carry a firearm in the Czech Republic

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You would think gun manufacturers would provide safety information and a user manual with each gun. It would also be good policy for retailers to demonstrate and show a buyer the safe handling of the gun being bought. Both the manufacturer and the seller should also stress the four points. I don’t think that would add undue expense to the purchase process. Perhaps an opportunity to try to sell additional safety devises or storage. Perhaps instead of gun “buybacks” the cities could engage police to sponsor events handing out locks or storage boxes for the less affluent and offer free handling and safety instruction. That is if the police could manage not to shoot anyone during the demonstration. It’s a right and its safe practice should be addressed as a civic issue and the government should be promoting responsible safe gun ownership instead of trying to eliminate a right or limit it.
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"Resistance is futile. You will be assimilated!" Loquacious of many. Texas Chapter Chief Cat Herder.

Re: Getting a license to purchase and carry a firearm in the Czech Republic

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sikacz wrote: Sun Nov 27, 2022 5:56 pm
highdesert wrote: Sun Nov 27, 2022 5:34 pm I'm not advocating for the Czech type licensing to purchase guns and for concealed carry. It's their system that seems to work for all political parties in their republic. We have a different constitution and laws in regard to firearms that's very different from our two closest neighbors, Canada and Mexico. I'm for talking about firearms laws in other countries including criticisms of their systems, discussion doesn't mean advocacy.
True enough, I just get a bit edgy on these discussions since I’m pretty sure where the gun prohibitionists would go with these type restrictions. To the prohibitionists it’s a step toward a system where gun ownership becomes a limited privilege for only the approved right kind of people. BTW, didn’t mean to imply you were advocating such.
No offense taken. I agree the goal of the anti-gunners is more and more gun restrictions and moving eventually to confiscation. CA, NJ and some other states are prime examples that they'll keep adding more and more restrictions. They have this utopian idea that once firearms are banned from most civilians that our society will be magically transformed and criminals will lay down their arms and there will be no more violence. And they probably think authoritarian regimes like Russia, China, Iran...will all disappear. They got sold this bill of goods by Everytown and other Bloomie and anti-gun group like the US Democratic Party.

There are already attacks on parts of 1A by the right and the left with cancel culture.
In a cancel culture, we appoint ourselves the arbiters of right and wrong and also the judge and jury, because thanks to social media, we get to dole out punishment.
Sadly #MeToo is a prime example of cancel culture, feeding frenzies on Twitter have become judge and jury.
https://dictionary.cambridge.org/us/dic ... el-culture
https://www.procon.org/headlines/is-can ... r-society/
"Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but not their own facts." - Daniel Patrick Moynihan

Re: Getting a license to purchase and carry a firearm in the Czech Republic

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Here's what's happening in Oregon with respect to this issue.
Less than two weeks remain for Oregon officials to hammer out a complex permitting regime for firearm ownership under Measure 114, and that could put the state in a constitutionally precarious spot.

Some gun rights advocates worry that if a permit mandate takes effect before a process is in place to acquire those permits, it could halt gun sales in Oregon.

--snrp--

Sheriff offices across the state issued 308,408 concealed carry permits in 2021, according to the Oregon State Police. Firearms sales aren’t tracked in Oregon but background checks are often used as a proxy because they are required for each purchase. The Oregon State Police averaged 929 background checks per day in 2021. That means an estimated 339,085 firearms were sold in Oregon in 2021.

In the first year under the new law, every person who buys a firearm will need to get a permit to purchase, roughly 340,000 people based on 2021 numbers. But permits are good for five years so the initial surge in demand would likely taper. It’s also not clear from the state’s data how many of the people who purchased firearms in 2021 already held concealed handgun licenses or chose not to apply for one, making it difficult to infer what impact the permit requirement will have on sheriff departments’ work loads.
https://www.opb.org/article/2022/11/25/ ... mit-rules/

Opponents of Measure 114 claim that the fees charged will not cover the work load. They also claim the measure could shut down gun stores if the process is not ready in time.

CDFingers
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While the firelight's aglow strange shadows from the flames will grow
'Til things we've never seen will seem familiar

Re: Getting a license to purchase and carry a firearm in the Czech Republic

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wings wrote: Sun Nov 27, 2022 6:05 pm I think their regulations are great policy. They work for Czechia. Whether they could work here is a different question, because our cultures and context are different.

I resented the idea that I needed to pass an 8 hour class with two hours on the range to be able to legally carry a concealed handgun back in the day, as a limitation of my 2A rights - but I also recognized the public safety aspects and strongly support training. I consider mandatory training requirements, provided in a safe and carefully regulated context, free of charge through the state, to be an optimal solution to the rights/responsibility dilemma. Putting gun training in the high schools doesn't seem to be a politically viable approach for a variety of reasons though.

Representational government is going to factionalize policy every time, so my opinions on good gun policy don't matter a whit so long as they're tied to unrelated policies on trade, immigration, civil rights, national defense, etc. Reasons I'm a fan of popular initiatives and direct democracy. It's the only way to make parties listen to the people.
How? The 2A speaks of owning a gun, not owning a 'concealed' gun.
AND I agree...it does have a 'pubic safety' component. NO way to mandate any sort of training, or licensing, or testing, even if free, at the federal level. BUT, as has been mentioned, the 'other rights', in spite of hyperbole like 'the pen is mightier than the sword' type declarations. always get mentioned. 'Tests' for free speech..but a practical and more comprehensive 'look' at potential gun buyers 'might' cut down o the spate of shootings..all at the hands of 'legal gun owners.

Re: Getting a license to purchase and carry a firearm in the Czech Republic

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sikacz wrote: Sun Nov 27, 2022 11:03 pm You would think gun manufacturers would provide safety information and a user manual with each gun. It would also be good policy for retailers to demonstrate and show a buyer the safe handling of the gun being bought. Both the manufacturer and the seller should also stress the four points. I don’t think that would add undue expense to the purchase process. Perhaps an opportunity to try to sell additional safety devises or storage. Perhaps instead of gun “buybacks” the cities could engage police to sponsor events handing out locks or storage boxes for the less affluent and offer free handling and safety instruction. That is if the police could manage not to shoot anyone during the demonstration. It’s a right and its safe practice should be addressed as a civic issue and the government should be promoting responsible safe gun ownership instead of trying to eliminate a right or limit it.
They do.
They don't unless asked. Too many buyers get their nighty in a knot if the retailer starts talking about things like gun safety..cuz, ya know, gun owners, know all about that stuff'. So most retailers don't say anything...
Neither do, particularly the retailer. I knew NOTHING about guns when I bought me first one..Ruger LC-9S..retailer just wanted a proper 4473, and my CC#.
CERTAINLY agree with that but that would be pretty far from where 'we' are now. Too often a 'government' 'promoting safe gun ownership' is viewed as stepping on 2A 'rights'..by some.

Re: Getting a license to purchase and carry a firearm in the Czech Republic

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I kind of like this line
“Guns are valued by gun holders,” said Martin Cervicek, a senator and former president of the Czech police forces. “But they are not viewed as sacred.”

Makes them sound like downright reasonable people. I don't think guns are essential to freedom, we just have so many examples to show that's just not a fact. That side of the case for the 2nd Amendment just never made sense to me. That said, I don't support anything that takes guns away...that's a pretty bad idea at this point in history. Its the kind of trouble we really don't need right now. Because if you physically take guns away, there's going to be a fight.
“I think there’s a right-wing conspiracy to promote the idea of a left-wing conspiracy”

Re: Getting a license to purchase and carry a firearm in the Czech Republic

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F4FEver wrote: Mon Nov 28, 2022 8:18 am
wings wrote: Sun Nov 27, 2022 6:05 pm I think their regulations are great policy. They work for Czechia. Whether they could work here is a different question, because our cultures and context are different.

I resented the idea that I needed to pass an 8 hour class with two hours on the range to be able to legally carry a concealed handgun back in the day, as a limitation of my 2A rights - but I also recognized the public safety aspects and strongly support training. I consider mandatory training requirements, provided in a safe and carefully regulated context, free of charge through the state, to be an optimal solution to the rights/responsibility dilemma. Putting gun training in the high schools doesn't seem to be a politically viable approach for a variety of reasons though.

Representational government is going to factionalize policy every time, so my opinions on good gun policy don't matter a whit so long as they're tied to unrelated policies on trade, immigration, civil rights, national defense, etc. Reasons I'm a fan of popular initiatives and direct democracy. It's the only way to make parties listen to the people.
How? The 2A speaks of owning a gun, not owning a 'concealed' gun.
AND I agree...it does have a 'pubic safety' component. NO way to mandate any sort of training, or licensing, or testing, even if free, at the federal level. BUT, as has been mentioned, the 'other rights', in spite of hyperbole like 'the pen is mightier than the sword' type declarations. always get mentioned. 'Tests' for free speech..but a practical and more comprehensive 'look' at potential gun buyers 'might' cut down o the spate of shootings..all at the hands of 'legal gun owners.
If I have the right to bear arms, it should matter little how I carry it.

Where I carry? Different question. Even licensed, I can't carry anywhere I frequent besides my home, grocery store, gun shop or range, due to entirely reasonable limitations about firearms on private property and sensitive public spaces.

The training I went through to get the license covered state law regarding use of force above and beyond gun safety, demonstration of basic proficiency, and an overview of prohibited places. I could have waited until Constitutional Carry legislation was passed, or carried illegally and hoped not to get caught, but I thought it would be useful to get licensed and it was a straightforward way to get defensive training above and beyond my childhood exposure to guns. It was good training and I recommend it even though we're now a 'Constitutional carry' state.

That's the thing - I take gun ownership seriously, with a myriad of responsibilities attached. The thought of causing harm to others through recklessness or ignorance makes my skin crawl. I wish more Americans felt the same way. If we all did, we wouldn't need to find legislative solutions, mandates or restrictions.

Our culture is one of those root causes that could use some attention.

Re: Getting a license to purchase and carry a firearm in the Czech Republic

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CDFingers wrote: Sun Nov 27, 2022 8:58 am The California firearms safety certificate test I found to be easy--all correct. The last gun I bought, my 1911, was bought under that certificate. I still have it in my wallet, though it is now expired. If I wanted to buy another gun--not needed to possess, just to purchase--I'd go back to the same gun shop and take the test again. I do not know of the failure rate. I think it an OK gate keeper. I did not know they had the RKBA, but that Czech permit seems a good thing. I'd like to see their battery of questions for kicks and giggles.

https://oag.ca.gov/firearms/fsc

CDFingers
I just took the new FSC, and I'm pretty sure it is a bit different from the old one (BSC) that I took in the '90s, which covered the Makarov and Mark II. Hard to remember for sure, but I think the old test was only 10 questions-- 15 or 20 at most. The new one is 30 questions, they are a big more challenging, though still dog easy.

I got one wrong: "It's sometimes illegal to fire a gun in the air." I got thrown by the 'sometimes' and answered "False" thinking it was always illegal. Apparently, that's incorrect. I'm still not firing any of my guns in the air!
F4FEver wrote:
sikacz wrote: Sun Nov 27, 2022 11:03 pm You would think gun manufacturers would provide safety information and a user manual with each gun. It would also be good policy for retailers to demonstrate and show a buyer the safe handling of the gun being bought. Both the manufacturer and the seller should also stress the four points. I don’t think that would add undue expense to the purchase process. Perhaps an opportunity to try to sell additional safety devises or storage. Perhaps instead of gun “buybacks” the cities could engage police to sponsor events handing out locks or storage boxes for the less affluent and offer free handling and safety instruction. That is if the police could manage not to shoot anyone during the demonstration. It’s a right and its safe practice should be addressed as a civic issue and the government should be promoting responsible safe gun ownership instead of trying to eliminate a right or limit it.
They do.
They don't unless asked. Too many buyers get their nighty in a knot if the retailer starts talking about things like gun safety..cuz, ya know, gun owners, know all about that stuff'. So most retailers don't say anything...
Neither do, particularly the retailer. I knew NOTHING about guns when I bought me first one..Ruger LC-9S..retailer just wanted a proper 4473, and my CC#.
CERTAINLY agree with that but that would be pretty far from where 'we' are now. Too often a 'government' 'promoting safe gun ownership' is viewed as stepping on 2A 'rights'..by some.
Correct. They absolutely do. The manuals for the Mark II and the Rough Rider were both well written and quite helpful, and settle many common points of contention. My FFL also did have me demonstrate safe handling of the gun, though it was a pretty basic demonstration-- point in a safe direction, engage the safety (optional for SA), open the loading gate, cock to the second click, etc. etc. A different branch of the same store sold me the Mark Ii, and they were even more thorough-- walked me through breaking down the gun completely, which is a little tricky for that particular pistol.

I can't remember where I bought the Mak, but I could have used a bit more instruction. It was the first handgun I ever shot, I barely knew how it worked, and the slide took a nice chunk out of my thumb the first round I fired-- which was the ONLY round I've ever fired from that gun which went straight through the center of the target!

If the FSC has gotten a bit harder and the safety demonstration a bit more involved over time, that's fine by me.
“Freedom is something that dies unless it's used.”
― Hunter S. Thompson

Re: Getting a license to purchase and carry a firearm in the Czech Republic

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Just as a comparison and not advocation, CA requires a test to purchase, including a safe handling demonstration, we have safe storage requirements, we have a 1 in 30 law, we have red flag laws, we have an AWB, we have a safe handgun roster, we have a mag limit, NFA items are illegal, we have ammo background checks and we have "might issue depending on which county you're in" CCW policies. We still have assholes murdering people with firearms. But it has certainly infringed on law abiding firearms owners.

Re: Getting a license to purchase and carry a firearm in the Czech Republic

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featureless wrote: Mon Nov 28, 2022 10:51 pm But it has certainly infringed on law abiding firearms owners.
Absolutely. The more I learn as I reacquaint myself with this sport, the more frustrating it seems.

It's like our go-to for everything is to go after either people who are completely law-abiding, or those who commit the most minor infractions. It's the same shit that drives me crazy in health care, like going after chronic pain patients with flawless refill records, and forcing them to either quit or take patent medications that are far more dangerous. Prescribing rates crashed, and the overdose rate is still soaring.

The answer isn't anarchy, but it ain't what we got now. What it feels like to me: Politicians don't want to get their hands dirty crafting reasonable rules, they're too terrified of getting it wrong, of having fingers pointed at them by the extremists.

What speaks to me about High Desert's post and the Czech system: I think it's possible. We could do better if we really tried, and stopped enabling hysteria. It might not even be as hard as we think it would be, but we'd have to take chances, try new things. And we would make mistakes along the way.

I'm not a football fan, but I think the history of making calls based on Instant Replay is an interesting analogy. It took the sport a LONG time to get it right. We actually rolled it out, got rid of it in disgust a few years later, and brought it back again. And I'm pretty sure it wasn't just the technology that evolved, it was how it was implemented.
“Freedom is something that dies unless it's used.”
― Hunter S. Thompson

Re: Getting a license to purchase and carry a firearm in the Czech Republic

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CDFingers wrote: Mon Nov 28, 2022 8:43 pm Duck hunters fire into the air a lot.

CDFingers
Incredibly, that never occurred to me. Dead serious. I'm at the counter filling in the little circles thinking, 'could this be a trick question? When would it be legal to shoot in the air? If you were being attacked by drones? Burglar on the roof?'

Grew up in Manhattan. Wasn't a lot of duck hunting at the Central Park Reservoir. I guess you can take the boy out of the city, but...!
“Freedom is something that dies unless it's used.”
― Hunter S. Thompson

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