Re: AOC condemns Harris for telling Guatemalans not to come to US

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NorthWoods wrote: Wed Jun 09, 2021 5:51 pm I generally agree with the criticisms of AOC here. We shouldn't be telling people to come here illegally.

But there are valid complaints about part of the reason Guatemala, Honduras, and El Salvador are messed up is because we continue to support right-wing regimes that terrorize their people.
And AOC did not tell people to come to the US illegally. She is highlighting the international treaty of accepting people fleeing persecution and violence. These humans literally fleeing for their lives... they are called asylum seekers. There is absolutely nothing illegal about it. We are bound by international law here the same way Europe has absorbed and struggled to help Syrian refugees and others from Northern Africa fleeing war and famine for decades. Those people coming North from our Southern border are escaping an invisible war; one where crime, violence, and murder are perpetrated with impunity because their failed governments cannot provide law and order nor economic stability. Again, due to decades of US involvement to destabilize their democratically elected governments and prop up these politically ineffectual ones.

You want to support a banana republic dictatorship to maintain a cheap source of poor and desperate workers for export goods to the US? Then don’t be surprised when the fools you installed can’t run a country so that when things really go to shit the cheap labor leave their own country and start rushing into yours. That is the gist of what is happening right now.

Asylum seekers are quite different from undocumented migrant workers who jump the line purely economic reasons. The right wing pundits love to conflate the two issues because they all look like “brown skin people” and more than a few Americans have been hoodwinked by such tactics.

Just like the talking heads who purposefully conflate “assault rifles” with “assault weapons” so as to make intelligent discussions about gun violence virtually impossible in the United States, here we also see the importance of calling each thing by its right name.
"It is better to be violent, if there is violence in our hearts, than to put on the cloak of non-violence to cover impotence. There is hope for a violent man to become non-violent. There is no such hope for the impotent." -Gandhi

Re: AOC condemns Harris for telling Guatemalans not to come to US

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Bisbee, great post IMHO.

I'm for open borders. Have never felt we have a "illegal" problem. Anyone believing these people are taking high paying jobs of legal citizens or stealing jobs from whites or ruining unions, is full of shit. They have always been an asset rather than a liability regardless of their origin. We should welcome them with open arms considering the damage this nation has done meddling in affairs of others. Not implying we have not done good in the world - far from it - but we have done much damage to the internal politics of others which caused mass immigration, in particular from the south to the tip of S. America. Most of what we have done has been to benefit US, rather than them - it's no wonder many hate us. Domino theory my ass be damned! Throw in our thirst for illegal drugs and the stupid drug war and we've been on the wrong side of right way to fucking long.
"Being Republican is more than a difference of opinion - it's a character flaw." "COVID can fix STUPID!"
The greatest, most aggrieved mistake EVER made in USA was electing DJT as POTUS.

Re: AOC condemns Harris for telling Guatemalans not to come to US

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The problem is the .gov needs to fix the legal immigration process. Hell, it takes a year of more. It's antiquated.
Farmers are moving their farms to Mehico because they cannot get workers to pick crops.

I used to jump the fence in Nogales back an forth when I was with my Hispanic buddies down the in the early 60's and no one said nothing. The fence was maybe 5 foot tall.
“The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing,”

Re: AOC condemns Harris for telling Guatemalans not to come to US

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On the other issue of undocumented laborers, the truth of it is if these so called “illegal aliens” all suddenly all became unavailable for whatever reason (like some right-winger’s deportation wet dream) our fruit & vegetable industry, meat processing industry, residential construction & improvement industry, restaurant & hospitality industry, any industry based on the hard labor of human hands would simply implode. The costs for just about everything we Americans are used to in daily living would double overnight due to labor shortage. In essence a large part of our economy would grind to a halt and instantly transforming our entire society.

Undocumented workers in the United States are also coming to the realization of their value on this side of the border. They are starting to organize, bolstered by the fearless and vocal protests of DREAMers.
"It is better to be violent, if there is violence in our hearts, than to put on the cloak of non-violence to cover impotence. There is hope for a violent man to become non-violent. There is no such hope for the impotent." -Gandhi

Re: AOC condemns Harris for telling Guatemalans not to come to US

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Bisbee wrote: Thu Jun 10, 2021 8:43 pm On the other issue of undocumented laborers, the truth of it is if these so called “illegal aliens” all suddenly all became unavailable for whatever reason (like some right-winger’s deportation wet dream) our fruit & vegetable industry, meat processing industry, residential construction & improvement industry, restaurant & hospitality industry, any industry based on the hard labor of human hands would simply implode. The costs for just about everything we Americans are used to in daily living would double overnight due to labor shortage. In essence a large part of our economy would grind to a halt and instantly transforming our entire society.

Undocumented workers in the United States are also coming to the realization of their value on this side of the border. They are starting to organize, bolstered by the fearless and vocal protests of DREAMers.
Businesses have been taking advantage of undocumented labor since we won the Mexican American war.
My friends family's have been here before before that war. A lot of today's Americans do not even know more than half western America was Mexico terroritys
“The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing,”

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