Impact of loss for firearm ownership in Virginia

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Impact of loss for firearm ownership in Virginia

Post by DispositionMatrix »

With it likely that HB 4021 will being repackaged for the next legislative session and rammed through, I am curious as to whether the pending outlawing of possession of forbidden semi-automatic firearms will stave off panic buying. Same for standard-capacity magazines.

There also was a state senate bill.
https://lis.virginia.gov/cgi-bin/legp60 ... sum+SB1748

Also, it will be interesting to see how the ATF handles pending Form 4s for Virginians in the interim between the bill passing and suppressors being banned.

Virginia governor says he will reintroduce gun control measures after Dems take over state government
“Getting rid of bump stocks, high volume magazines, red flag laws. These are common-sense pieces of legislation,” he told CNN’s John Berman on “New Day.” “I will introduce those again in January. And I’m convinced, with the majority now in the House and the Senate, they’ll become law and because of that, Virginia will be safer.”

Democrats took control of the Virginia House and Senate on Tuesday for the first time in more than 20 years. Northam and Democrats will now have an advantage in the assembly to pursue gun control measures that Republicans have pushed against and blocked.

Following a mass shooting at a Virginia Beach municipal building in May that left 12 people dead, Northam called a special session to debate gun control, but it was adjourned by Republicans without action. A ban on assault weapons and high-capacity magazines and reinstating Virginia’s one-handgun-a-month law were among eight policy proposals Northam introduced ahead of the session.
For CNN fans:
Virginia governor says he will reintroduce gun control measures after Dems take over state government

Thread on the state house bill:
Democratic Virginia Delegate's bill to ban "assault firearm," std cap mags, suppressors, "trigger activators"

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Re: Impact of loss for firearm ownership in Virginia

Post by lurker »

i'm not accustomed to playing the alarmist-gunnut role, somebody wake me up please.

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Re: Impact of loss for firearm ownership in Virginia

Post by VodoundaVinci »

Slowly but surely the attempt will be made to disarm US. I'm pretty sure eventually we will be disarmed as the Republic declines. I'm not going to willingly comply - there are rumors of Virginia going the route of making it a Felony to be in possession of a semi automatic so if/when Illinois goes that way I'll be a criminal after living a whole Life as a model citizen. Never arrested, never missed a house payment, votes, nurtures/teaches. Hell, I don't even speed.

But this current and growing fascination with disarming me or making me a criminal persists mostly because (I believe) that as the Republic declines and evaporates people feel the need to "do something" to stop mass/school shootings which are, in reality, caused by the stress and anxiety created in our failing and floundering Republic. We are driving people crazy/sick enough to murder but we can't see that and instead blame the guns and their owners as the reason.

Virginia is arguably the birthplace of The United States of America and maybe it'll be the foundation and first State to force it to reform.

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Re: Impact of loss for firearm ownership in Virginia

Post by DispositionMatrix »

lurker wrote:
Fri Nov 08, 2019 9:42 am
is this the future of gun ownership in america? no semiauto handguns or rifles with interchangeable mags over 10 rounds? eventually no semiautos at all? what am i supposed to do, turn them in to be crushed? i'd still have my bolt guns, with which i could likely in theory toast 2 or 3 jackbooted thugs before they spot me and their overwhelming firepower overwhelms. a sad state of affairs when the good oll USofA looks just like communist china or russia, ruled by oligarchs with their hired thugs and no way to defend ourselves against our oppressors.

there's that bit in wells' "time machine" where the protagonist finds a revolver in a museum, morlocks preying on eloi all the while, will it be like that?

i'm not accustomed to playing the alarmist-gunnut role, somebody wake me up please.
Well, in North Carolina you already have a permit to purchase requirement for handguns, a CHP requirement, and a ban on private sales of handguns without government involvement. So I suspect firearm prohibitionist state politicians will skip to the end and float publicity-friendly bans at the first opportunity.

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Re: Impact of loss for firearm ownership in Virginia

Post by tonguengroover »

virginia.png
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Re: Impact of loss for firearm ownership in Virginia

Post by K9s »

Nah. VA was artificially gerrymandered to be GOP for too long. This blue flip is going to happen in TX and GA in the future, too. The way the GOP describes it here - they built a red wall to hold back the blue wave. Unfortunately, that isn't democracy.

It will take a long time for VA to adopt CA regulations. They won't go all in right away. If they do, it is the fault of GOP for bottling up all gun control and never compromising or discussing. They cannot cheat and demonize the opposition for years and expect compromise.
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Re: Impact of loss for firearm ownership in Virginia

Post by MayhemVI »

So far I'm not seeing any Virginians in this thread. So let's just take a moment to ponder: Are Virginia's Democrats Democrats first, or Virginians first?

In other words, who here knows how any of these votes are going to go?
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Re: Impact of loss for firearm ownership in Virginia

Post by DispositionMatrix »

K9s wrote:
Sun Nov 10, 2019 2:46 pm
It will take a long time for VA to adopt CA regulations. They won't go all in right away. If they do, it is the fault of GOP for bottling up all gun control and never compromising or discussing. They cannot cheat and demonize the opposition for years and expect compromise.
Given Virginia firearm owners already are subject to all federal restrictions plus the state's concealed carry licensing requirement and state machine gun registration requirement, what do you envision as an example of the "compromising" that should have taken place in Virginia with regard to "gun control"?

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Re: Impact of loss for firearm ownership in Virginia

Post by CDFingers »

tonguengroover wrote:
Sun Nov 10, 2019 11:55 am
virginia.png
California could buy Virginia and lease it to Nevada for sea coast access. VA never could be CA because it's too small, too poor, too suthun and too foolish. Sorry.

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Re: Impact of loss for firearm ownership in Virginia

Post by lurker »

i lived in virginia for a couple of years in the 90s, and at that time virginia, very much like any other place, was 2 different places: the DC metro area with surrounding bedroom communities, and the rest of the state, rural in general, but even if urban, still connected to the countryside. in my day there, the dividing line was just east of dulles airport, but since i left the sleepy little towns i lived in have been swallowed up by development. i suspect what we're seeing is driven by the growing urban/rural mindset, and presages what's going on in other states. city people, while they may benefit from guns for home defense(a mixed bag wrt safety, especially if you have kids) and enjoy the out-of-doors, are not intimately connected to nature or self-reliance.
Last edited by lurker on Mon Nov 11, 2019 6:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Impact of loss for firearm ownership in Virginia

Post by lurker »

CDFingers wrote:
Mon Nov 11, 2019 10:04 am
California could buy Virginia and lease it to Nevada for sea coast access. VA never could be CA because it's too small, too poor, too suthun and too foolish. Sorry.
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nor would anyone sensible want to be california :ras:
Last edited by lurker on Mon Nov 11, 2019 10:10 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Impact of loss for firearm ownership in Virginia

Post by VodoundaVinci »

I'm a big lover and believer in Cowboy Logic - simple things that are clear and easy to use as a code to guide me. One of my favorites - "Telling a man the get lost and making him do it are two entirely different propositions"

Virginia may indeed make it a felony to posses semi automatic firearms. But arresting and prosecuting the people who do not comply/will not comply is a completely different proposition. I'll be watching this very closely to see how that works for them. I personally doubt it will actually pass but I'm willing to be wrong. I'm under the impression that these things will not get solved or resolved until it gets broken so hopefully they'll break it so the fix can begin soon.

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Re: Impact of loss for firearm ownership in Virginia

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As Democrats triumph in Virginia, pro-gun groups confront ‘worst scenario’
“Tonight, all my thoughts and prayers go out to the NRA’s leaders and lapdogs,” Watts told the jubilant crowd as Virginia’s statehouse flipped blue. “And tomorrow, they can pack their shit and git.”
John Feinblatt, the president of Everytown for Gun Safety, a national group founded by former New York Mayor Michael Bloomberg that spent $2.5 million to help create Democratic majorities in the state legislature, said Virginia’s elections would send a message to politicians in suburban districts across the country.
In a few months, that dynamic will be reversed, with gun-control supporters controlling the flow of legislation and gun-rights groups left with little power to stop it.

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Re: Impact of loss for firearm ownership in Virginia

Post by highdesert »

Only time will tell if Everytown is crowing too early or if this is the future direction of VA. The NRA has been quiet, haven't heard much from the AG investigation in NY State where they are chartered and now this in VA where they are headquartered. They did issue a statement on the VA election.
"As if Gov. Northam’s legacy of ineptitude wasn’t enough, Virginians are about to experience life under a distant tycoon’s thumb. Candidates who proudly accepted Bloomberg’s cash—and every voter they misled—will soon realize the cost of being beholden to a Manhattan billionaire who despises Virginians’ right to self-defense. Fortunately, many NRA-backed candidates in Virginia, New Jersey, Kentucky and Mississippi prevailed over their Bloomberg-funded opponents. As the battle continues, so does the NRA’s defense of the Second Amendment rights of all Americans.”
https://www.nraila.org/articles/2019110 ... on-results
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Re: Impact of loss for firearm ownership in Virginia

Post by max129 »

CDfingers said:

... too small, too poor, too suthun and too foolish ...

I see that Inter-State rivalry is not dead on the East Coast ;-)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_U ... per_capita

Virginia is the 12th largest of the US States. It is a Commonwealth, not a State, the meaning of which has diluted over the centuries.

By GDP per person, Virginia has 96% of the GDP per person as California. Cost of living adjusted, Virginian's earn 105% as much as Californians.

5 US Presidents came from Virginia, but it has had no real political power since the Civil War.

I was raised in Virginia and went to her best University. I cannot return to my home Commonwealth however:

- The heat and humidity in the Summer are insufferable
- The mosquitos swarm in huge clouds
- The racial tensions in the Southern parts of Virginia are palpable

I visit Virginia to see my brother every few years. Most of the Southern areas look like a time capsule from my youth. Few new buildings, little economic growth, a residual tobacco industry. Heat, Humidity, Mosquitos, Racial Tension. What more could one wish for?

In some ways, politics in Virginia reminds me of California. The "red" parts of Virginia are mostly to the South, and the "blue" parts to the North.

I have another brother, who told me "but for the population around Washington DC distorting Virginia, it would clearly be all red" ... I suppose that is so.

As for "foolish", I confess that all of the former slave States appear to have really weird State level legislatures - I can think of no exceptions, and I am pretty current on the matter. Sure, Raleigh and Atlanta are pretty modernized cities. I visit both a few times a year for business reasons. But poke into the State level legislative records and a hot mess surfaces.

This push-me-pull-me tug of politics is the last stand of the mass migration from rural to urban life that occurred in the last Century. Our Constitution artificially preserves the power of the rural vote; I will leave it to others to decide if this is a healthy buffer or an anachronism.

And here I see how isolated I am from my "neighbors", and also why I visit this forum: few urbanites are 2A advocates. Whatever the charms and benefits of urban living are, they seem to weed out the individualism I see in most gun owners. (You may send counter arguments to that last sentence to this special email address - nononehere@devnull.com)

As I have said elsewhere, I both believe in the 2A and believe it is an endangered species. It is a quirk of history that we codified the RKBA as clearly as we did (and not quite clearly enough, eh?) Look around the world and the RKBA is clearly in the decline. Most of the other G7 Countries think us barbarous for retaining the RKBA. While I do not need to agreed with them, I can see which way the wind blows.

Recently. Switzerland (and in case you don't know the place, I should have put it in all CAPS). SWITZERLAND voted to reduce their own RKBA. I have spent many, many months living in Switzerland. The Swiss I know believe that gun ownership is essential to their self preservation. I have listened to this conversation many times over dinner all around Switzerland. I have been shooting with Swiss friends often. They do not have a "gun culture", they have a "self-defence religion". And yet, for the right of continued commerce with the EU, the Swiss voted to "normalize" their laws regarding gun ownership.

I do not like this. I do my best to counter the trend, but in retrospect, the recent swelling of gun buying and gun ownership in the United States looks more counter-reactionary to me than a long term trend. The number of gun owners is declining year on year. Until 1995, I only ever owned two firearms at a time. One long gun and one hand gun. I maintained that number until less than 10 years ago, when my collection grew. But the global political trend lines do not favor a continuance in the RKBA. And truly, it is rather easy to regulate out. I will remind people of how scarce 22 LR ammo became just a few years ago in a very short time frame.

Yes, I know that many people have reloading equipment and supplies. But a few small changes here and there (California's ammo laws?) and things could change quickly.

In summary, I see the recent changes in Virginia WRT gun rights as one more squawk from the Canaries in the Coal Mine of gun rights.

Think this is a Democratic vs Republican issue? Then tell us all, exactly how the Republicans have advanced long term gun rights outside of the Supreme Court.
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Re: Impact of loss for firearm ownership in Virginia

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highdesert wrote:
Mon Nov 11, 2019 10:48 am
Only time will tell if Everytown is crowing too early or if this is the future direction of VA. The NRA has been quiet, haven't heard much from the AG investigation in NY State where they are chartered and now this in VA where they are headquartered. They did issue a statement on the VA election.
"As if Gov. Northam’s legacy of ineptitude wasn’t enough, Virginians are about to experience life under a distant tycoon’s thumb. Candidates who proudly accepted Bloomberg’s cash—and every voter they misled—will soon realize the cost of being beholden to a Manhattan billionaire who despises Virginians’ right to self-defense. Fortunately, many NRA-backed candidates in Virginia, New Jersey, Kentucky and Mississippi prevailed over their Bloomberg-funded opponents. As the battle continues, so does the NRA’s defense of the Second Amendment rights of all Americans.”
https://www.nraila.org/articles/2019110 ... on-results
Does anybody else notice that, despite all the 1000s of people who donate to a certain cause, the NRA and GOP always seem to single out the wealthy Jewish guy for scorn?
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Re: Impact of loss for firearm ownership in Virginia

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Bloombwerg vs Gates:

I was invited to a statistics forum where Bill Gates was speaking. It was a pretty small group.

One of the folks there asked Gates why he was so focused on "foreign issues" such as mosquito nets in Africa and why not join Bloomberg in the anti-gun funding.

His answer was classic Bill Gates: "Any analysis of the impact on anti-gun funding shows no yield in public safety, morbidity or mortality."

In my opinion, Bloomberg's funding of anti-gun legislation is a waste of money and misguided. We write about "root cause" often on this forum. If people like Bloomberg want to address the "root cause" of gun ownership in the US, maybe they should start with the Second Amendment. But, OH, they HAVE LOOKED at the 2A and decided it is an unscalable wall, so they put their efforts into (IMO) a subversive model of eroding what the 2A means.
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Re: Impact of loss for firearm ownership in Virginia

Post by highdesert »

They do not have a "gun culture", they have a "self-defence religion".
They are still an independent and neutral country surrounded by the EU, but not part of the EU. They wanted the open borders which comes with being a party to Schwegen and that meant agreeing to EU gun regs which weren't even popular within the EU. The Gnomes of Zurich likely had a big influence, it's business and commerce that feeds their economy.

They are wise to maintain their "self-defense religion", the Russian Bear to the east is not dead and the future is unknown. The Swedes understand it, they brought back military conscription.
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Re: Impact of loss for firearm ownership in Virginia

Post by tonguengroover »

Thats my kinda country out there. Roanoke https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hvKyBcCDOB4
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Re: Impact of loss for firearm ownership in Virginia

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I love flying into that little Roanoke airport. I can smell the forest.
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Re: Impact of loss for firearm ownership in Virginia

Post by Marlene »

I’m pretty sure we had no loss in Virginia.
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Re: Impact of loss for firearm ownership in Virginia

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As Democrats Prepare To Take Power In Virginia, Gov. Northam Focuses On Gun Control
Democratic Gov. Ralph Northam vows it's "a new day and a new landscape" in Virginia. He says when Democrats take over the state legislature for the first time in a generation at the start of the new year, passing gun violence prevention laws will be a top priority.

He adds guns "shouldn't be a partisan issue," even though he says he's prepared to pass new "common sense" gun laws without Republican support.
"Dealing with the gun violence in Virginia will be a top priority of our administration," Northam said. "Now certainly with a Democratic Senate and House, I believe we can move forward with common sense gun legislation."

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Re: Impact of loss for firearm ownership in Virginia

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Impact of possible gun control vs impact of social services...
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Re: Impact of loss for firearm ownership in Virginia

Post by VodoundaVinci »

I wonder if we made health care for all (including mental health) a priority and made sincere efforts to stop the controlling, bullying behavior of Corporations and empowered people to have power over their own lives and destinies we might do more to combat gun violence than any new "common sense" gun regulations and laws.

Nahhhh. Never mind. :see_stars:

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Re: Impact of loss for firearm ownership in Virginia

Post by lurker »

you mean like addressing root causes of violence? yeah, pipe dream.

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