How do you debate anti-hunters?

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Even though i've never hunted I've read a lot about hunting practices and also learned about hunter safety through the firearm safety course I took through the DNR back in 2010. I've now started teaching my son about the importance of hunting while also trying to be careful not to label anti-hunters as 'ignorant morons' in front of him, even though I do think they're ignorant morons. My former father in-law is an avid hunter and fisherman. As such, my son gets to enjoy the fruits of his hunting/fishing when he visits the farm.

The reason I bring it up is because I still come across anti-hunters wherever on the internet (I'll use Instagram as an example). On Instagram I occasionally check out Filson's page. They post a combination of wildlife, hunting and fishing photos to pics of their gear. I came across a post they recently did of some guy cleaning an Elk's rack and while reading the comments I noticed some woman trolling their post with her anti-hunting vitriol. I then clicked on her profile and noticed that she had many posts of her dogs, which are undoubtedly fed meat, and another of her posting a pic of pulled pork that she bought at the grocery store. The hypocrisy of her post really p*ssed me off because she saw fit to get on her pedestal and chastise people that harvest their own meat all while she buys her fancy shrinkwrapped meat from the grocery store. This person clearly knows nothing about carrying capacity, sustainable yields, starvation and/or disease among animal populations.

'Luckily for me i've never quite had to shut someone down over hunting, but i'm curious if any of you hunters out there have gotten into shouting matches with anti's that see fit to impose their self-righteous morality onto you.

Re: How do you debate anti-hunters?

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Life is too short to worry about trolls. Just tell her that hunters take direct responsibility for their meat, unlike her who makes supermarkets do it.

You will never shut these guys out, they have a personal problem and they need to vent. Add your comment then move on.
Glad that federal government is boring again.

Re: How do you debate anti-hunters?

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I've got no problem with hunters, though I'm not one.

But the dumb yahoos who come onto your land, put up deer platform in your woods without permission, shoot too close to houses, hunt at night, or drink beer or whiskey while hunting that I have a problem with. Still have the 3-bladed arrow one yahoo shot into my shed, less than 100' from my house, from my neighbor's posted land, right through a chain-link fence!

IOW, my views on hunters are the same as gun-owners. I got nothing against responsible ones and everything against the irresponsible yahoos who fuck everything up for the rest of us!
"Even if the bee could explain to the fly why pollen is better than shit, the fly could never understand."

Re: How do you debate anti-hunters?

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Hunting does not call me. I see it as "game management." We've upset the predator prey balance, so humans need to manage the existing prey. The hunter who does not eat the meat or give it to be eaten--that guy, nah. Not my friend. The ones who eat are fine by me.

Anti hunters have a point to be made with sport hunters who don't eat the kill.

CDFingers
Crazy cat peekin' through a lace bandana
like a one-eyed Cheshire, like a diamond-eyed Jack

Re: How do you debate anti-hunters?

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CDFingers wrote: Wed Apr 10, 2019 6:30 pm Hunting does not call me. I see it as "game management." We've upset the predator prey balance, so humans need to manage the existing prey. The hunter who does not eat the meat or give it to be eaten--that guy, nah. Not my friend. The ones who eat are fine by me.

Anti hunters have a point to be made with sport hunters who don't eat the kill.

CDFingers
Like these two shit-head assholes:
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"Even if the bee could explain to the fly why pollen is better than shit, the fly could never understand."

Re: How do you debate anti-hunters?

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Ignore the anti-hunters. I used to fish and hunt more. I know where my food comes from. We humans are omnivores. If they don't want to face the truth, they can be vegan. More meat for me.
It is an unfortunate human failing that a full pocketbook often groans more loudly than an empty stomach.

- Franklin D. Roosevelt

Re: How do you debate anti-hunters?

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Huh...I thought tigers were the most dangerous, because they just don't give a fuck. I think it' Burma or India where they still wear masks on the back of their heads because tigers almost always attack from behind.

Someone really needs to make giant land lobsters...no one would complain about hunting those.
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"Person, woman, man, camera, TV."

Re: How do you debate anti-hunters?

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senorgrand wrote: Wed Apr 10, 2019 8:15 pm Huh...I thought tigers were the most dangerous, because they just don't give a fuck. I think it' Burma or India where they still wear masks on the back of their heads because tigers almost always attack from behind.

Someone really needs to make giant land lobsters...no one would complain about hunting those.
I do not know. Tigers live in Asia, Leopards in Africa and ARE more dangerous to humans than lions. Of course, hippos kill the most people in Africa, being big, strong, ill-tempered and paranoid!
"Even if the bee could explain to the fly why pollen is better than shit, the fly could never understand."

Re: How do you debate anti-hunters?

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Not a Hunter, never was, probably never will be unless a HUGE amount of sh!t hits a large enough fan, but... I love shooting, and hunting has produced some notable shots and methods. So, I like to read around the subject.

If you have never read Gene Hill's books, you should. This quote is from "A Hunter's Fireside Book" and illustrates his style very nicely. The Chapter is called "Why" and touches on why people hunt, and how to deal with those that ask why.
Gene Hill wrote: A friend of mine who makes his living, more or less, by working, more or less, for a gun company, is by nature a big game hunter. His answer as to why his house is decorated from cellar to attic with heads of antelope, impala and the outer garments of lion and leopard and zebra, is guaranteed to stop the nonsense. He merely smiles a very mysterious smile that I'm sure he's practiced over African campfires, and says "Oh, I guess I just like to hear the thus of bullets smack against some solid flesh."
"We have met the enemy and he is us." Pogo.
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Re: How do you debate anti-hunters?

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senorgrand wrote: Wed Apr 10, 2019 8:36 pm Yeah...lots of people killed by hippos because people think they are cute. Probably the most dangerous plant-eater on the planet.
Yeah, angered elephants are rarer, but I suspect even more dangerous. Personally, I'm not in the business of pissing off animals, especially really, really big ones!
"Even if the bee could explain to the fly why pollen is better than shit, the fly could never understand."

Re: How do you debate anti-hunters?

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SailDesign wrote: Wed Apr 10, 2019 8:50 pm Not a Hunter, never was, probably never will be unless a HUGE amount of sh!t hits a large enough fan, but... I love shooting, and hunting has produced some notable shots and methods. So, I like to read around the subject.

If you have never read Gene Hill's books, you should. This quote is from "A Hunter's Fireside Book" and illustrates his style very nicely. The Chapter is called "Why" and touches on why people hunt, and how to deal with those that ask why.
Gene Hill wrote: A friend of mine who makes his living, more or less, by working, more or less, for a gun company, is by nature a big game hunter. His answer as to why his house is decorated from cellar to attic with heads of antelope, impala and the outer garments of lion and leopard and zebra, is guaranteed to stop the nonsense. He merely smiles a very mysterious smile that I'm sure he's practiced over African campfires, and says "Oh, I guess I just like to hear the thus of bullets smack against some solid flesh."
We hunted to eat. I think it is unethical/sinful to kill something for fun or bloodthirsty thrills. Food or defense.

I do kill bugs in very few instances. Mosquitoes, flies, some rodents, and roaches - for sanitary and health reasons. Nearly everything else is spared if I can help it. It drives some people crazy when I "save" a spider from inside the house.
It is an unfortunate human failing that a full pocketbook often groans more loudly than an empty stomach.

- Franklin D. Roosevelt

Re: How do you debate anti-hunters?

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An environmentalist friend of ours posted on facebook about how she saw a hunting blind, it had a hunter in it (who actually stepped out and told her, when she asked, that it probably wasn't safe to walk her dog there during the two week deer shotgun season), then went on about how she isn't against hunting but they need to keep their firearms away from her hiking trails (it's on watershed property, totally legal and he had a permit to be there, she didn't, and she can't have her dog there either), and then her other friends piled on with the anti-hunter stuff. I tried to educate and say how the sporting community has done a lot more than the liberal community to preserve open spaces and bring wildlife back from the edge of extinction. She got all worked up about it. It's a losing battle.
"...just smash your piano, and invoke the glory-beaming banjo!" ~Mark Twain

Re: How do you debate anti-hunters?

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GoldenRetrieversRule wrote: Wed Apr 10, 2019 9:31 pm An environmentalist friend of ours posted on facebook about how she saw a hunting blind, it had a hunter in it (who actually stepped out and told her, when she asked, that it probably wasn't safe to walk her dog there during the two week deer shotgun season), then went on about how she isn't against hunting but they need to keep their firearms away from her hiking trails (it's on watershed property, totally legal and he had a permit to be there, she didn't, and she can't have her dog there either), and then her other friends piled on with the anti-hunter stuff. I tried to educate and say how the sporting community has done a lot more than the liberal community to preserve open spaces and bring wildlife back from the edge of extinction. She got all worked up about it. It's a losing battle.
Change the context, and it's no different than someone bitching about two LGBTQ people kissing, say, on a park bench, or holding hands. It offends the viewer. Tough shit! Look away! They aren't hurting anyone or breaking a law. Just 'cuz it makes the viewer uncomfortable is no reason to make it illegal, or bitch about it.

ANOTHER M*A*S*H quote:
B.J.Honeycutt wrote:Minding my own business is a full-time job. In my spare time, it's my hobby.
"Even if the bee could explain to the fly why pollen is better than shit, the fly could never understand."

Re: How do you debate anti-hunters?

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GoldenRetrieversRule wrote: Wed Apr 10, 2019 9:31 pm An environmentalist friend of ours posted on facebook about how she saw a hunting blind, it had a hunter in it (who actually stepped out and told her, when she asked, that it probably wasn't safe to walk her dog there during the two week deer shotgun season), then went on about how she isn't against hunting but they need to keep their firearms away from her hiking trails (it's on watershed property, totally legal and he had a permit to be there, she didn't, and she can't have her dog there either), and then her other friends piled on with the anti-hunter stuff. I tried to educate and say how the sporting community has done a lot more than the liberal community to preserve open spaces and bring wildlife back from the edge of extinction. She got all worked up about it. It's a losing battle.
Yes, I have often wondered why the pro-2A and pro-environment groups didn't coexist better. I guess it is because both groups have so many diametrically opposed a-holes.

If someone could harness both groups...
It is an unfortunate human failing that a full pocketbook often groans more loudly than an empty stomach.

- Franklin D. Roosevelt

Re: How do you debate anti-hunters?

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Assholes are everywhere. Even among people you 100% agree with. I learned this as 9 year old kid at a radical progressive summer camp. I asked the camp director, a man who worked and even went to jail for civil rights, a college professor, a question he didn't want to answer in a camp meeting. He said "What are you, a Philadelphia lawyer?" Everyone, roughly 100-150 people, laughed at me, 9 years old, and I learned that a harsh lesson that day. Later, the wisest professor I ever had (we argued CONSTANTLY, disagreed about everything and I worshiped him!) said a clear indicator that you had won an argument was when your opponent belittled you! I remembered that camp day, a decade earlier and felt a lot better. I did read the camp director's obit with a bit of schadenfreude a few years ago.
When I learned my professor had passed away, I was deeply saddened.
"Even if the bee could explain to the fly why pollen is better than shit, the fly could never understand."

Re: How do you debate anti-hunters?

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I went on my first hunt last year at 45. My in-laws all hunt, so I'd been wanting the experience. I saw one buck across a draw but it was outside my comfort zone, so maybe I'll see it again next year. Hunting is a tradition. I support ethical hunting for all manner of reasons. It gets people into "the nature." Groups like California waterfowl have made tremendous gains in making sure we still have waterfowl.

Re: How do you debate anti-hunters?

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YankeeTarheel wrote: Wed Apr 10, 2019 9:54 pm Assholes are everywhere. Even among people you 100% agree with. I learned this as 9 year old kid at a radical progressive summer camp. I asked the camp director, a man who worked and even went to jail for civil rights, a college professor, a question he didn't want to answer in a camp meeting. He said "What are you, a Philadelphia lawyer?" Everyone, roughly 100-150 people, laughed at me, 9 years old, and I learned that a harsh lesson that day. Later, the wisest professor I ever had (we argued CONSTANTLY, disagreed about everything and I worshiped him!) said a clear indicator that you had won an argument was when your opponent belittled you! I remembered that camp day, a decade earlier and felt a lot better. I did read the camp director's obit with a bit of schadenfreude a few years ago.
When I learned my professor had passed away, I was deeply saddened.
Maybe learning that lesson (like a lot of us did) makes it so easy to see right through bullies like DJT.
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It is an unfortunate human failing that a full pocketbook often groans more loudly than an empty stomach.

- Franklin D. Roosevelt

Re: How do you debate anti-hunters?

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Yeah, OK, I'm an anti hunter. I've been a vegetarian for 44 years. I have no pets because I won't buy meat to feed to them.

I do not attempt to change hunters minds about hunting because I don't think I can. I am more of a live and let live kind of person. I have said to conservative hunters, "hey, I won't mess with you for being a hunter, if you don't mess with me for being a lesbian. We leave each other alone, how 'bout it?" Most of the time they agree.

If you shoot it and don't eat it, you suck. Those pecker-heads that kill big game for fun, also suck.
I hear hunters say, "I never shoot unless I have a good clean shot, and I never miss." Bullshit. I've lived in the country and heard those guys taking their 3 shots with their semiauto in 1-2 seconds. They're just blazing away.

Then there is the guy who buys a 4 wheeler, to get to the hunting site 200 yards off the road. Then buy a $1000 trailer to haul the 4 wheeler and a 40,000 4WD pickup to pull the trailer with the 4 wheeler. He has a thousand dollar rifle, a 500 dollar scope, and expensive scent free camo. He's had an automated feeder in the woods for weeks, and all those top-of-the-line field cameras. So after spending $75,000 he tries to claim, "It's all about putting food on the table!!!" :roflmao: :roflmao: :no: :no: :no:

I am very happy that there is a separate hunting section on this forum. In general I stay out of it. So folks go out and enjoy your hunting. The vegetarians and the hunters seem to always get along on this forum, but of course, we're liberals.
All religions united with government are more or less inimical to liberty. All, separated from government, are compatible with liberty.-Henry Clay
Both oligarch and tyrant mistrust the people, and therefore deprive them of their arms.—Aristotle

Re: How do you debate anti-hunters?

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They have lots of misconceptions, brought about by Hollywood portrayals. They think if you want to hunt a deer, you grab your gun, get in your truck, and head to the woods, 24/7 365 days per year*. They know nothing of licenses, seasons, tags, bag limits etc. And they think it's "easy" or "unfair" because the animals don't have rifles. Dispel those beliefs first. They don't really care about "population control" or tradition.

*well true in AusNZ, nowhere in the US.

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