Experience with Project Appleseed events?

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Curious what people's experiences are with Project Appleseed events? I am interested in engaging in some more formal marksmanship training and getting some actual credentials under my belt for being a competent shooter...I consider myself pretty accurate with my 22.

I'm in Montana, so I will be leaving politics at the door, but are these events legit and worthwhile? I'm less interested in Civil War reenactment, but in perusing the website they seem to be open to scopes and semi-autos rather than just iron sight bolt actions. Are they worth the time? Does an Appleseed recognition of proficiency hold water as a legit qualification?

Like I said, brand new with no idea about these events, but interested, so any thoughts on them would be much appreciated!

Re: Experience with Project Appleseed events?

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I went to an Appleseed clinic, and I think it’s well worth the price. It strives to be apolitical, which I appreciate. It’s based on the old Army training manual and test for the M1 Garand, which is why you’ll have segments where you shoot 8 and 2 rounds, despite the 10/22 mag capacity of 10.

Will it teach you to be an expert? No. It’s not possible to do that in 2 days. However, it will give you a solid foundation in rifle marksmanship.
Glad that federal government is boring again.

Re: Experience with Project Appleseed events?

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Stiff wrote: Tue Mar 02, 2021 3:27 pm I went to an Appleseed clinic, and I think it’s well worth the price. It strives to be apolitical, which I appreciate. It’s based on the old Army training manual and test for the M1 Garand, which is why you’ll have segments where you shoot 8 and 2 rounds, despite the 10/22 mag capacity of 10.

Will it teach you to be an expert? No. It’s not possible to do that in 2 days. However, it will give you a solid foundation in rifle marksmanship.
Anyone shoot it with a Garand?
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"Resistance is futile. You will be assimilated!" Loquacious of many. Texas Chapter Chief Cat Herder.

Re: Experience with Project Appleseed events?

5
I went a few years back. It is an excellent class. There were plenty of people helping teach the class and ensure range safety. There are 3 parts to the class, the actual range time shooting, instruction/theory, and a history lesson about Paul Revere's ride.

While they say the class is non-partisan, they are all conservative. But they stick to the class program and behaved professionally. I am definitely going to repeat the class as soon as it is covid safe. Most people have a ruger 10/22. Don't get into any political discussions and you'll be fine.
All religions united with government are more or less inimical to liberty. All, separated from government, are compatible with liberty.-Henry Clay
Both oligarch and tyrant mistrust the people, and therefore deprive them of their arms.—Aristotle

Re: Experience with Project Appleseed events?

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sikacz wrote: Tue Mar 02, 2021 6:19 pm
Stiff wrote: Tue Mar 02, 2021 3:27 pm I went to an Appleseed clinic, and I think it’s well worth the price. It strives to be apolitical, which I appreciate. It’s based on the old Army training manual and test for the M1 Garand, which is why you’ll have segments where you shoot 8 and 2 rounds, despite the 10/22 mag capacity of 10.

Will it teach you to be an expert? No. It’s not possible to do that in 2 days. However, it will give you a solid foundation in rifle marksmanship.
Anyone shoot it with a Garand?
Not during my events. It takes about 200-250 rounds per day, so it gets expensive when you do it with anything other than .22 LR. However, I did see some folks using their AR.
Glad that federal government is boring again.

Re: Experience with Project Appleseed events?

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Stiff wrote: Tue Mar 02, 2021 7:01 pm
sikacz wrote: Tue Mar 02, 2021 6:19 pm
Stiff wrote: Tue Mar 02, 2021 3:27 pm I went to an Appleseed clinic, and I think it’s well worth the price. It strives to be apolitical, which I appreciate. It’s based on the old Army training manual and test for the M1 Garand, which is why you’ll have segments where you shoot 8 and 2 rounds, despite the 10/22 mag capacity of 10.

Will it teach you to be an expert? No. It’s not possible to do that in 2 days. However, it will give you a solid foundation in rifle marksmanship.
Anyone shoot it with a Garand?
Not during my events. It takes about 200-250 rounds per day, so it gets expensive when you do it with anything other than .22 LR. However, I did see some folks using their AR.
They allow hand loads or just factory?
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"Resistance is futile. You will be assimilated!" Loquacious of many. Texas Chapter Chief Cat Herder.

Re: Experience with Project Appleseed events?

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sikacz wrote: Tue Mar 02, 2021 7:39 pm
Stiff wrote: Tue Mar 02, 2021 7:01 pm
sikacz wrote: Tue Mar 02, 2021 6:19 pm
Stiff wrote: Tue Mar 02, 2021 3:27 pm I went to an Appleseed clinic, and I think it’s well worth the price. It strives to be apolitical, which I appreciate. It’s based on the old Army training manual and test for the M1 Garand, which is why you’ll have segments where you shoot 8 and 2 rounds, despite the 10/22 mag capacity of 10.

Will it teach you to be an expert? No. It’s not possible to do that in 2 days. However, it will give you a solid foundation in rifle marksmanship.
Anyone shoot it with a Garand?
Not during my events. It takes about 200-250 rounds per day, so it gets expensive when you do it with anything other than .22 LR. However, I did see some folks using their AR.
They allow hand loads or just factory?
They didn’t check ammo, so I assume anything is ok.
Glad that federal government is boring again.

Re: Experience with Project Appleseed events?

9
I was planning on going last spring, then everything got shut down. I'm going to try again this year. I'm curious if those of you who have done the training think I would be ill served to use my CZ 457. I have a 10/22 Takedown, but I'm not anywhere near as accurate with it as I am with the CZ. Just starting to get methodical about figuring out what's going on there. I know there are timed drills that might earn one the coveted Rifleman patch, and sure, a guy can dream, but I'm more interested in unlearning all of the bad habits I've most probably gotten into being totally self taught at this point. They do suggest bringing a backup rifle so I'll bring both.

Another factor I'm considering is how long I can effectively shoot. I'm not used to being in prone or sitting or kneeling position for many hours a day. The 24+" barrel on my CZ is certainly heavier and not as well balanced as the 10/22 is, but I just haven't been getting the consistent results with the Ruger that I get with the CZ.

Re: Experience with Project Appleseed events?

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Project Appleseed is about tradition, history, and patriotism. During breaks and during lunch, the volunteers recanted fascinating and inspiring stories from the Revolutionary War.

Day 2 of Project Appleseed consisted of more range time, practicing the fundamentals we learned with the goal of getting a high enough score on a target to earn the coveted Project Appleseed “Rifleman” patch. Unfortunately for me, I experienced my first ever migraine headache and by noon could barely see straight, much less shoot. So I headed home early and didn’t get my Rifleman patch. But I did enjoy the time I spent in Project Appleseed. For the modest price they charge (about $80.00) it’s excellent foundational training in good rifle marksmanship – either for a beginner, or as a refresher for a more seasoned shooter. It’s also an excellent way to gain a better appreciation for our nation’s history.

If you haven’t ever attended a Project Appleseed event, you owe it to yourself to block out a weekend in your schedule and go. It’s fun, educational, and darn good marksmanship training – even if you, like myself, have had other training.

Re: Experience with Project Appleseed events?

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DavidS wrote: Sun Mar 21, 2021 12:22 pm I was planning on going last spring, then everything got shut down. I'm going to try again this year. I'm curious if those of you who have done the training think I would be ill served to use my CZ 457. I have a 10/22 Takedown, but I'm not anywhere near as accurate with it as I am with the CZ. Just starting to get methodical about figuring out what's going on there. I know there are timed drills that might earn one the coveted Rifleman patch, and sure, a guy can dream, but I'm more interested in unlearning all of the bad habits I've most probably gotten into being totally self taught at this point. They do suggest bringing a backup rifle so I'll bring both.

Another factor I'm considering is how long I can effectively shoot. I'm not used to being in prone or sitting or kneeling position for many hours a day. The 24+" barrel on my CZ is certainly heavier and not as well balanced as the 10/22 is, but I just haven't been getting the consistent results with the Ruger that I get with the CZ.
The problem with the Ruger takedown is the connection between the barrell and the receiver. Having said that, I got my Rifleman patch with a Ruger Takedown Lite. I adjusted the ring on the receiver until the barrel wouldn’t go in, then backed it off and retried one click at a time. It resulted in a rock-solid connection that took an effort to put on or take off. This is vital for consistency, especially because Appleseed teaches you to tension the sling. Without a solid mating, the barrel will flex in relation to the receiver when you pull on the sling, and it’s bad because the scope on the 10/22 is on the receiver.
Glad that federal government is boring again.

Re: Experience with Project Appleseed events?

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Stiff wrote: Sun Mar 21, 2021 4:01 pm
The problem with the Ruger takedown is the connection between the barrell and the receiver. Having said that, I got my Rifleman patch with a Ruger Takedown Lite. I adjusted the ring on the receiver until the barrel wouldn’t go in, then backed it off and retried one click at a time. It resulted in a rock-solid connection that took an effort to put on or take off. This is vital for consistency, especially because Appleseed teaches you to tension the sling. Without a solid mating, the barrel will flex in relation to the receiver when you pull on the sling, and it’s bad because the scope on the 10/22 is on the receiver.
Thank you, great advice. Mine is very tight to get on now, but I'll see if I can take it another click or two.

Re: Experience with Project Appleseed events?

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DavidS wrote: Sun Mar 21, 2021 9:34 pm
Stiff wrote: Sun Mar 21, 2021 4:01 pm
The problem with the Ruger takedown is the connection between the barrell and the receiver. Having said that, I got my Rifleman patch with a Ruger Takedown Lite. I adjusted the ring on the receiver until the barrel wouldn’t go in, then backed it off and retried one click at a time. It resulted in a rock-solid connection that took an effort to put on or take off. This is vital for consistency, especially because Appleseed teaches you to tension the sling. Without a solid mating, the barrel will flex in relation to the receiver when you pull on the sling, and it’s bad because the scope on the 10/22 is on the receiver.
Thank you, great advice. Mine is very tight to get on now, but I'll see if I can take it another click or two.
One more thing, I find my accuracy with the 10/22 decreases after a full day of shooting (approx. 200 rounds). I found that part of the issue is build up of soot / lead in the barrel, the other part is fatigue.

Make sure you clean up the barrell with a bronze brush. Bore snake is not good enough. Test your accuracy and rezero afterward. The cleaning can have a drastic enough result that rezeroing is needed.

After the first day you’ll need to brush it again if you hope to get close to the Rifleman patch. In the beginning of the next day they’ll give you an opportunity to zero your rifle; use it.
Glad that federal government is boring again.

Re: Experience with Project Appleseed events?

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Stiff wrote: Sun Mar 21, 2021 10:02 pm
One more thing, I find my accuracy with the 10/22 decreases after a full day of shooting (approx. 200 rounds). I found that part of the issue is build up of soot / lead in the barrel, the other part is fatigue.

Make sure you clean up the barrell with a bronze brush. Bore snake is not good enough. Test your accuracy and rezero afterward. The cleaning can have a drastic enough result that rezeroing is needed.

After the first day you’ll need to brush it again if you hope to get close to the Rifleman patch. In the beginning of the next day they’ll give you an opportunity to zero your rifle; use it.
Thank you very much, that will be an interesting test. I've put 1,532 rounds through it and most always have only used a snake. I'll try a thorough cleaning before making any other changes.

Re: Experience with Project Appleseed events?

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DavidS wrote: Sun Mar 21, 2021 12:22 pm I'm curious if those of you who have done the training think I would be ill served to use my CZ 457.

Another factor I'm considering is how long I can effectively shoot. I'm not used to being in prone or sitting or kneeling position for many hours a day.
As far as the CZ goes, not yes, but hell yes! The next time I go, I will use my CZ452 Ultra Lux.

As for fatigue, yes you will get tired by the end of the day. But I don't recall any shooting session lasting more than 10-15 minutes. Then you're up watching a demo or sitting in chairs listening to a history lesson. It constantly rotates between short sessions of shooting, training/demo, and history lesson.

Be prepared for any and all weather conditions. Think: too hot, too cold, too wet, too dry, too windy, too sunny, too thirsty, too hungry! I didn't. It was cold and rainy that morning so I dress for that. Thirty minutes into the class, the sun came out and I roasted!!!
All religions united with government are more or less inimical to liberty. All, separated from government, are compatible with liberty.-Henry Clay
Both oligarch and tyrant mistrust the people, and therefore deprive them of their arms.—Aristotle

Re: Experience with Project Appleseed events?

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Hiker wrote: Mon Mar 22, 2021 11:26 am
DavidS wrote: Sun Mar 21, 2021 12:22 pm I'm curious if those of you who have done the training think I would be ill served to use my CZ 457.

Another factor I'm considering is how long I can effectively shoot. I'm not used to being in prone or sitting or kneeling position for many hours a day.
As far as the CZ goes, not yes, but hell yes! The next time I go, I will use my CZ452 Ultra Lux.

As for fatigue, yes you will get tired by the end of the day. But I don't recall any shooting session lasting more than 10-15 minutes. Then you're up watching a demo or sitting in chairs listening to a history lesson. It constantly rotates between short sessions of shooting, training/demo, and history lesson.

Be prepared for any and all weather conditions. Think: too hot, too cold, too wet, too dry, too windy, too sunny, too thirsty, too hungry! I didn't. It was cold and rainy that morning so I dress for that. Thirty minutes into the class, the sun came out and I roasted!!!
That Ultra Lux is a beautiful rifle! My 457 is a Lux and I'm really enjoying it. Thanks for the information and great advice. Layered clothes, food and water will be the plan.

Re: Experience with Project Appleseed events?

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sun screen, insect repellent. Also on a bright sunny day, the metal on you rifle will be very hot!!!! 3 or 4 light colored bandannas could be very handy to cover exposed metal (while still letting RO check for safety.)
All religions united with government are more or less inimical to liberty. All, separated from government, are compatible with liberty.-Henry Clay
Both oligarch and tyrant mistrust the people, and therefore deprive them of their arms.—Aristotle

Re: Experience with Project Appleseed events?

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Hiker, I’ve been wondering about why a rifle like an UltraLux wouldn’t work out. My 455 UltraLux is a beautiful shooting rifle with an extremely smooth bolt action. Let us know how it goes if you take your 452 UltraLux. People always seem to recommend a 10/22, but deep down I’m not convinced.
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"Resistance is futile. You will be assimilated!" Loquacious of many. Texas Chapter Chief Cat Herder.

Re: Experience with Project Appleseed events?

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Here’s my consideration when it comes to bolt action vs. semi auto for Appleseed.

The target is designed for 4 MOA precision, which translates to 1 inch at 25 meters. Semi auto mass-produced or service rifles have about 2 MOA precision. A good shooter at prone unsupported position is expected to add 2 MOA, to the total of 4.

A good bolt action rifle is often capable of less than 1 MOA, so it can compensate for a less skilled shooter who only manages to keep 3 MOA. However, operating the bolt adds at least 2 seconds between shots. You also lose the sight picture when you move the head away from the scope, so you have to search for the target for every shot.

In stage 2 of the test you’ll have to fire 10 rounds to 2 targets with one reload in 55 seconds. That’s 5 seconds per shot if you only spend 5 seconds reloading. In stage 3 you’ll fire 10 rounds to 3 smaller targets with one reload in 65 seconds. You can see now why the bolt action poses a considerable challenge for the speed stages.
Glad that federal government is boring again.

Re: Experience with Project Appleseed events?

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Stiff wrote: Mon Mar 22, 2021 9:26 pm Here’s my consideration when it comes to bolt action vs. semi auto for Appleseed.

In stage 2 of the test you’ll have to fire 10 rounds to 2 targets with one reload in 55 seconds. That’s 5 seconds per shot if you only spend 5 seconds reloading. In stage 3 you’ll fire 10 rounds to 3 smaller targets with one reload in 65 seconds. You can see now why the bolt action poses a considerable challenge for the speed stages.
So if the rifle you used had only ten round magazines to shoot stage 3 you need 3 magazines?
"it's a goddamn impossible way of life"
"And so it goes"

Re: Experience with Project Appleseed events?

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geno wrote: Mon Mar 22, 2021 9:45 pm
Stiff wrote: Mon Mar 22, 2021 9:26 pm Here’s my consideration when it comes to bolt action vs. semi auto for Appleseed.

In stage 2 of the test you’ll have to fire 10 rounds to 2 targets with one reload in 55 seconds. That’s 5 seconds per shot if you only spend 5 seconds reloading. In stage 3 you’ll fire 10 rounds to 3 smaller targets with one reload in 65 seconds. You can see now why the bolt action poses a considerable challenge for the speed stages.
So if the rifle you used had only ten round magazines to shoot stage 3 you need 3 magazines?
No, you just need 2 magazines. One is loaded with 2 rounds, the other with 8. Shoot 2 into the first target, reload, shoot 1 more into the first, 3 into the second, then 4 into the last.
Glad that federal government is boring again.

Re: Experience with Project Appleseed events?

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Stiff wrote: Mon Mar 22, 2021 10:44 pm
geno wrote: Mon Mar 22, 2021 9:45 pm
Stiff wrote: Mon Mar 22, 2021 9:26 pm Here’s my consideration when it comes to bolt action vs. semi auto for Appleseed.

In stage 2 of the test you’ll have to fire 10 rounds to 2 targets with one reload in 55 seconds. That’s 5 seconds per shot if you only spend 5 seconds reloading. In stage 3 you’ll fire 10 rounds to 3 smaller targets with one reload in 65 seconds. You can see now why the bolt action poses a considerable challenge for the speed stages.
So if the rifle you used had only ten round magazines to shoot stage 3 you need 3 magazines?
No, you just need 2 magazines. One is loaded with 2 rounds, the other with 8. Shoot 2 into the first target, reload, shoot 1 more into the first, 3 into the second, then 4 into the last.
Gotcha, I was thinking ten rounds at each target.
"it's a goddamn impossible way of life"
"And so it goes"

Re: Experience with Project Appleseed events?

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So I will be going to one in June, but I don't shoot a 10/22, I shoot a Marlin model 60, which does not have any magazines but rather a 14 capacity feeding tube. That would give me adequate capacity, but do they require the reload? I suppose I could just top off pretty quick and easy.

And Sika, when I signed up they said both irons and glass are acceptable, and were even more encouraging of irons...I still plan on using my glass though.

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